# Vietnam and social distance shaped Silicon Valley's defense divide

Markdown copy of https://realalpha.app/s/vietnam-and-social-distance-shaped-silicon-valleys-defense/ on Real Alpha, the best minutes from long interviews with the people building AI. Cite and link the page, not this copy.

- Speaker: [Trae Stephens](https://realalpha.app/people/trae-stephens/) · Anduril
- Host: [David Friedberg](https://realalpha.app/people/david-friedberg/) · CEO, Ohalo · Founded The Climate Corporation, sold to Monsanto for about $1.1B in 2013.
- Show: All-In
- Episode: [The State of Modern War: Palantir & Anduril Execs on Drones, AI, and the End of Traditional Warfare](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/), Apr 6, 2026
- Moment: 55:44 to 59:05 of the episode (3 min), playing on https://realalpha.app/s/vietnam-and-social-distance-shaped-silicon-valleys-defense/; the episode from there: https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3344

## Quote

> “There were, like, **less than 12 documented cases** where someone got access to data that they shouldn't have.”
> — [Trae Stephens](https://realalpha.app/people/trae-stephens/) at [57:06](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3426) · All-In

## Takeaways

1. They trace an enduring split between academia and defense to Vietnam.
2. Trae says reviews found fewer than 12 improper data-access cases.
3. They say fewer students now have close family ties to military service.

## About this segment

They trace distrust to the Vietnam-era split between academia and defense, and to fewer personal ties with military service. Trae Stephens also cites fewer than 12 documented cases of improper data access after Snowden.

From “The State of Modern War: Palantir & Anduril Execs on Drones, AI, and the End of Traditional Warfare”, Apr 6, 2026. [Watch the full episode](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/)

## Transcript

Transcribed by machine (Whisper) from the episode’s audio, so a word may be off here and there.

[55:54](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3354) and actually looked into these things. So people take this incredibly seriously. Where does the culture come from? The anti-defense tech alignment culture, is it because of the peace era that we had and folks took for granted national security? I think the first schism was really during Vietnam, where people felt like they were lied to about the war. It drove a fundamental schism between academia and defense.

[56:18](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3378) And we've never really healed from that schism. And so there's this kind of sense, this distrust that's brewed there and kind of escalates through society. The second schism is like the number of people who are prior service or are connected to this community who actually see these people as humans and have a fully informed mental model of how diligent they are, how the work actually gets done. What do these words actually mean?

[56:40](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3400) What is the process like is evaporated. So then their own fears fill how they think it happens. And it seems like maybe it's happening more in a cowboy way. Maybe it's happening in a way without oversight that there is no such thing as doctrine. Like, it's kind of a cartoon version of what's actually happening that I think you're unable to reconcile. Yeah, I think if you even look back at what happened with Snowden, you know, what was that, 15 years ago now, something like that?

[57:06](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3426) You know, there was almost no discussion about the investigations that went into, like, was the data collection actually abused? And the answer was, like, basically not at all. There were, like, less than 12 documented cases where someone got access to data that they shouldn't have. And it was because of like technology errors, not because of the policies that were implemented. And so, you know, we can have disagreements about whether or not the intelligence community should have collected the data and stored it.

[57:34](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3454) But that was that policy was renewed multiple times by multiple administrations, multiple political parties that had the majority in Congress over decades. And so apparently our elected representatives thought that it was important enough to keep in the system. So I think it ends up being this kind of weird policy discussion. But the second point that you make, I completely agree with about like the the kind of distrust of the institution in creating the stories for themselves.

[58:03](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3483) I oftentimes go and do guest lectures at Stanford, and I always try to ask, like, raise your hand if you have an immediate family member that serves in the military. No one ever raises their hand. It's crazy. Like at Sanford, there are veterans that come in that go to the GSB and things like that. But in like the undergraduate student population, it's incredibly rare for anyone to have any connection whatsoever in their immediate family to the military.

[58:29](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3509) And I think there's like, you know, some of this goes back to criticisms that people like J.D. Vance, the vice president, has made about, you know, elites in America and things like that. But there's just this incredible divide that has happened. And we're kind of losing touch with that kind of salt of the earth, middle of the country, you know, veteran community that I feel like was way more present during the Cold War and, you know, the World War II before that.

[58:55](https://realalpha.app/v/mjNP5IOzCbA/?t=3535) Do you think that there's any external influence that's driving this culture?