# Steven Crowder: "80% the Next President is a Democrat"

Markdown copy of https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/ on Real Alpha, the best minutes from long interviews with the people building AI. Cite and link the page, not this copy.

Steven Crowder argues that the right should unite around evidence, immigration and cultural priorities, while online media must resist unsupported viral claims.

- Show: TRIGGERnometry
- Hosts: [Konstantin Kisin](https://realalpha.app/people/konstantin-kisin/) & [Francis Foster](https://realalpha.app/people/francis-foster/)
- Guest: [Steven Crowder](https://realalpha.app/people/steven-crowder/) is a comedian and political commentator.
- Published: Nov 4, 2026
- Length: 1 h 58 m

## The best minutes

- [18:52](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1132) [Why Crowder sees inconsistency driving the MAGA split](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-sees-inconsistency-driving-the-maga-split/) (5 min)
- [41:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2485) [Why Crowder says US populism can be pro-market](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-says-us-populism-can-be-pro-market/) (8 min)
- [1:24:21](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5061) [Why Crowder says online media shifted from truth to clicks](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-says-online-media-shifted-from-truth-to-clicks/) (5 min)

## Also worth watching

- [25:14](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1514) [Why Crowder says he changed his mind on trade](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-says-he-changed-his-mind-on-trade/) (3 min)
- [50:59](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3059) [Why Crowder links government policy to rising costs](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-links-government-policy-to-rising-costs/) (6 min)
- [1:06:18](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3978) [Why Crowder links a Bolsonaro passport case to his show](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-links-a-bolsonaro-passport-case-to-his-show/) (3 min)
- [1:09:00](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4140) [Why Crowder says political debate has a steelmanning gap](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-says-political-debate-has-a-steelmanning-gap/) (4 min)
- [1:41:26](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6086) [Why Crowder opposes guaranteed US aid to Israel](https://realalpha.app/s/why-crowder-opposes-guaranteed-us-aid-to-israel/) (3 min)

Skip the opening biography and Trump record, the woke and abortion discussion, the immigration and charity stretch, and the closing gender-roles discussion.

## Full analysis: Steven Crowder says Democrats have an 80% 2028 chance if Senate flips

- Crowder gives Democrats an 80% 2028 win chance if they flip the Senate and hold both chambers.
- He says his team ran numbers, but offers no method or assumptions for that probability.
- Treat it as a conditional scenario to investigate, not a forecast to budget around.

Its 7 sections, what it means for you and what to watch are on [the page](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/#analysis), free with an account:

- [20:38](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1238) His 80% forecast lacks a visible calculation
- [21:03](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1263) Consistency guides Crowder’s reading of MAGA dissent
- [20:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1225) Primary participation offers a clearer strategic mechanism
- [45:39](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2739) His mobility case uses a lifetime estimate
- [52:11](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3131) Affordability has causes beyond Crowder’s policy diagnosis
- [25:35](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1535) Tariffs test his stated free-market boundary
- [1:26:20](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5180) His evidence standard should reach his own forecasts

## Summary

Crowder says he was born in Detroit, raised in Montreal and began stand-up at about 18. He describes moving from television and acting into online political commentary; the interview discusses his Change My Mind format, and the description notes his lawsuit against CNN.

Crowder argues that the right should judge Trump and its factions by consistency and evidence, while he sees border control and cultural issues as central to MAGA. He says the left will repackage, not abandon, ideas he calls woke, and argues that U.S. economic populism can favor market mobility and personal responsibility over socialism. He criticizes right-wing creators who present conspiracies as fact and says media and audiences should demand evidence. He also argues that feminism has left young women with poor role models and unrealistic expectations.

### Minute by minute

- [1:24](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=84) **Crowder traces his route into commentary.** Crowder says he was born in Detroit and raised in Montreal in a Christian household. He says Norm Macdonald inspired him to try stand-up, that he was labeled right-wing at 12, and that he appeared on Fox News at 21. He describes college gigs being canceled over jokes about political subjects and says he later built his career outside mainstream entertainment.
- [7:56](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=476) **Crowder says Trump delivered on priorities.** Crowder recalls feeling powerless during the 2020 election coverage and says he later added news wires and data analysts to his election stream. He says Trump has done more than any president in his lifetime on immigration and cultural issues, while acknowledging disappointments. On Iran, Crowder says Trump’s long-stated position means the war is not a betrayal, though he criticizes its communication and conduct.
- [18:41](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1121) **Crowder says MAGA needs consistency.** Crowder argues that prominent critics of Trump have shifted their positions, while he has supported or criticized Trump as he sees fit. He says MAGA’s future should remain centered on national priorities, strong borders and a social component. He warns that if Democrats win both chambers, he estimates they would have an 80% chance of winning in 2028, and says Republicans could then nominate a candidate like Romney or McCain.
- [25:14](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1514) **Crowder says trade needs equal terms.** Crowder says he changed his view on trade after concluding that foreign tariffs disadvantaged U.S. industries; he favors equalizing terms rather than rejecting trade. He calls immigration a defining issue and argues that cultural disputes, including compelled language, shape society rather than distract from it. He presents his experience with demonetization and a YouTube policy he says became known as the Crowder rule as examples of cultural pressure.
- [30:47](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1847) **Crowder warns woke ideas will repackage.** Crowder compares the left’s response to criticism to a child finding a less obvious way around a rule. He argues that activists have changed how they frame consent after backlash to MeToo, and says the same ideas are being sold in new terms. He also argues that Democrats will soften their language on trans issues and abortion without abandoning the underlying positions he opposes.
- [41:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2485) **Crowder favors market-based populism.** Crowder argues that U.S. populism can make a free-market case because he sees more class mobility and opportunity there than in many other countries. He cites an estimate that 70% of Americans will reach the top 20% of earners at some point in their lives. He contrasts that promise with socialism and says COVID-era restrictions transferred wealth toward large companies.
- [49:55](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2995) **Crowder blames policy for high costs.** Francis Foster argues that inflation and asset appreciation have widened the gap between asset owners and others. Crowder replies that housing, higher education and health care have been heavily subsidized or regulated, and says those policies helped drive costs. He argues that market competition, rather than more government intervention, could make homes, insurance and education more affordable.
- [56:20](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3380) **Crowder favors voluntary charity.** Crowder contrasts voluntary giving with government redistribution and argues that religious and conservative people give more to charity. He distinguishes people who need occasional help from those he describes as unwilling to work. He also argues that a large welfare state and open borders cannot coexist, because he says new arrivals can draw on public systems.
- [1:06:18](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3978) **Crowder says opponents misread motives.** Crowder recounts that a Brazilian judge froze a Bolsonaro family member’s passport after remarks by his brother on Crowder’s show, and says prominent left-wing figures did not condemn the action. He argues that left-leaning speakers more readily assign evil motives to conservatives, while people on the right can better restate left-wing arguments. Crowder says millennials who became conservative had to defend those views, while liberal assumptions were accepted by default.
- [1:15:24](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4524) **Crowder demands evidence for conspiracies.** Crowder criticizes right-wing commentators who circulate claims about Charlie Kirk’s killing, Churchill, Macron and Israel’s role in Venezuela. He says the claims he discusses lack evidence and argues that audiences should apply the same test to every political side. He says some conspiracy content draws on true-crime audiences rather than representing the typical Trump voter.
- [1:24:21](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5061) **Crowder says lies now outdraw truth.** Crowder says independent online media first gained traction by challenging legacy outlets, but now sensational falsehoods can attract more attention than accurate reporting. He advises audiences to move on from creators who do not provide references for factual claims. He says his show provides references and a way to flag corrections, and worries that short-form feeds encourage people to treat political claims as entertainment.
- [1:34:28](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5668) **Crowder warns clip culture harms debate.** Crowder says cross-spectrum conversations have value, but argues that some podcasts now plan questions to generate viral clips. He demonstrates how a speaker can use insinuations to create a misleading clip without providing evidence. He says online media could continue to displace legacy outlets or become a click-driven space he describes as dead internet.
- [1:41:26](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6086) **Crowder rejects blank checks for Israel.** Crowder says Israel has a right to exist but argues that the United States should not guarantee it funding or be tied to it as a matter of policy. He supports cooperation where the countries’ interests overlap and says their interests can also diverge. He calls for transparency about political funding and says AIPAC should register under FARA.
- [1:45:53](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6353) **Crowder says feminism leaves women unhappy.** Crowder argues that feminism has weakened gender norms and left young women with few positive media role models. He criticizes Call Her Daddy for promoting casual sex and delaying marriage and family, and says its host does not live by that advice. Crowder cites ratings and happiness data that he says show women have more unrealistic expectations and are becoming less happy, and argues that women need to address the gap in dating and family life.

## Transcript

TRIGGERnometry, hosted by Konstantin Kisin and Francis Foster, with Steven Crowder.

Transcribed by machine (Whisper) from the episode’s audio, so a word may be off here and there.

[0:01](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1) Clip culture has ruined everything. People are looking for a clip. Blacks, trans and kids, you guys got anything else? That will do. Mexicans. What people would view as the radical right-wing view is more reasonable than the moderate left view. I am not going to disagree with any other group more consistently than the left, including, by the way, billionaires, elites, Jews, accountants. Name me one person on that platform. One person who ran for president in the last cycle who had a reasonable approach. Do you think the left is going to say, no, no, you're right. No cocks in women's sports. Do you think they're going to say that?

[0:39](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=39) I don't think they'll use that language. Do you think they'll even concede the principle? AOC saying woke 1.0, it was crazy. It implies there is a woke 2.0 coming, just by the logic of it. It's just it's selling it differently. It's packaging it in a way that doesn't look woke. These people are Marxists. That is who they are. Do you like annoying people just by taking a sip of coffee or the clothes you're wearing? Then head over to our merch store where you'll be able to buy hoodies, T-shirts, caps, prints, stickers, posters, and of course, the world famous Trigonometry mug. Go to shop.triggerpod.co.uk. That's shop.triggerpod.co.uk and become part of the show.

[1:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=85) So, Stephen Crowder, welcome to Trigonometry. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. We've been trying to have you on for a long time. So glad it's happened. Before we get into the conversation we want to have, we want to talk about what's happening on the right in the U.S., what's happening on the left. Tell us your story. Well, before that, can we just have a gentleman's agreement that this should be fun? Because I know we have to get the clips. That's why you make sure fun happens, is you have an agreement. Exactly. no it's just this is i often don't do like sit down interviews because you know clip culture has ruined everything so people are looking for a clip so let's just get out of the way like jews blacks kkk which camera should i look to is it that one jews banks blacks uh trans and kids you guys got anything else that will do mexicans right and now don't agree with any of them i just i dislike all of them let's just say that so we can actually have a conversation because that's big thing that was the veneer of a conversation and you can feel people like and uh it's like the old improv like yes and they're waiting for you to salute like i don't ah there it is so um but yes thank you for having me it's not like i was avoiding you guys you guys picked the worst

[2:31](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=151) cities yeah we do you come to the states it's like new york l.a austin it's like you just get like a bum piss map it's still if i were to think that america is this way like that was my perception like this is a horrible place well actually we've done we've had the chance to go out of the big cities a couple of times so we were just in rural michigan i've been to colorado utah so i've seen a little bit more of it okay and that's always cool because you kind of go oh i thought i understood america and actually i don't know where in michigan did you get up north like traverse city area well we were in hillsdale oh okay hillsdale college yeah yeah yeah yeah we drove past the data center that was being built oh that's always fun uh and the guy was like i don't know how many jobs they're going to create, but there's going to be a lot of security jobs.

[3:13](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=193) Yeah, exactly right. Well, there'll be a lot of jobs for a short amount of time, and then it'll be, you know, self-managing. So that's always good. Yeah. Well, it's in the spirit of keeping things fun. Yeah. Everyone's going to lose their job. Yeah. Let's talk about data centers and AI. Anyway, tell us your story. How'd you get here? Well, the driver on the way here was Brazilian. And do you mean... I meant like my life story. And my arms are tired. Yeah. No, I was, so born in Detroit, um, which should be annexed and then raised in Montreal, Canada. So my mom's French Canadian, my dad's American, and I was raised there from three till I left for, I was just doing standup about 17 or 18, I think about 18. And, uh, yeah, raised in a lap of socialism. You'll get people who are mad about it. It is effectively socialism in Quebec and it's very different from the rest of Canada. And, uh, yeah.

[4:00](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=240) My whole, all my formative years, that's really what's different, I would say, between my background and my approach is, so like I appeared on Fox News, I was 21 years old, and I never wanted, they would say, youngest contributor, I'm like, let's not say that, because sooner or later that, you know, I'm not going to be that, and I didn't really like to operate off of gimmickry. But they didn't know what they wanted to do with me. They just would, like, put me on a debate panel with Alan Combs or Alicia Menendez. Her dad was a senator, you know, stocking gold bars in his ceiling, and now he's in an orange jumpsuit.

[4:29](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=269) And I did okay with the debate, but it wasn't my thing. And when I showed up, I didn't know who Sean Hannity was. I didn't know any... Because I grew up in Canada where we didn't really have AM radio. Occasionally we could pirate something, like we'd get Rush Limbaugh from Plattsburgh, New York. And so the people I grew up watching, David Letterman, I can tell you the day I wanted to do stand-up, I was at the Just for Last festival. I watched Norm Macdonald in 1994, I believe, do a bit. And I used to be, since you've done stand-up, I'm sure you have festivals, like, when they broadcast it, they have seat fillers, which is people, they might not show up, like, they might have corporate seats.

[5:03](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=303) So for the cameras, they don't want it to be empty. They go, you go out to B7, B4. So I got to sit at the world's biggest comedy festival and watch the greatest comedians really on the planet. So it was five to ten comics every night hosted by a big name. Like, one night would be Jerry Seinfeld. One of my favorites was Dame Edna. Then it was Michael Richards. He didn't yell about hanging N-words in a tree when I was there. And I watched Norm Macdonald, and his joke was so different, and the pacing was so different that it just left a mark. I said, okay, I guess I want to do that. And I was never really aware of the fact that I was super conservative until my drama teacher accused me of being a right-wing zealot when I was 12.

[5:46](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=346) I asked my dad what that meant, and he said, who told you that? I was like, my drama teacher's like, this bitch. And he explained it to me, and I went back and told him, so that's what I am, right-wing. I was raised in a Christian household, but the conversations just took place around the dinner table. And then I would be canceled from college gigs just because I would have bits that might be what people would consider politically incorrect or today anti-woke. you know jokes about islam jokes about and it was clean too um it was not like it was blue jokes about feminism whatever it is i'm talking about like when i'm 16 17 18 and uh it was a pretty rude awakening and then i came full circle i started acting first the first thing i ever did was the show arthur on pbs little aardvark you know that show yeah i know yeah he has a pet dog and a sister and i was the brain the bear um it was very out of care that's why it's acting it's like batman can't play batman he has to play c auditions for superman he's like otherwise it's not acting so um yeah i then full circle to stand up and boy i was dropped by my manager dropped by an agent early on because uh the john stewart show daily show this was a real was a real moment for

[6:52](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=412) me they reached out to my manager it's like hey do you have anyone like this guy like stephen crowder like you know kind of young you know edgy but like but we don't do conservative and then i heard him go out publicly and said we just chase the funny and i was like well no you don't so uh yeah i just i kind of threw up my flag and the allies found me and it took me into this milieu but this is not what i ever intended to do um and here we are here i'm talking with uh an ex-russian expat russian i guess and uh and you you say venezuelan but let's be honest i mean i know you are but uh are there that many white people in venezuela is it like listen man my dad's irish king came along and bleached everything so you know it's it's like those areas of brazil where you're like what's 75 italian oh the mussolini people playing whereas i'm officially english now those are the rules are you yeah not as far as i'm concerned well that's tough though because like you say russian people look at you like you could be in one of those you know sar uh castles or you could be yelling allahu akbar on a plane and that's right people buy it more likely the latter i think yeah yeah you're generically ethnic like abercrombie also temperamentally i'm more like that are you yeah

[7:57](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=477) Blow and shut up. Plus, if he hasn't eaten, that's... When he gets a bit, you know, yeah, it gets a bit passionate. All right. So let's talk about what's happening in America. One of the things that is interesting to us is just being outside observers, looking in. I remember being here in Austin two years ago. Gross. I cannot disagree with that. But it was an exciting time for a lot of people, especially people on the right, because it was quite clear Trump was about to win and not clear what the scale of the win would be. And we were flying to L.A. the day of the election. So we didn't know. And everybody in Austin was like, oh, you're going to L.A.

[8:36](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=516) It's going to be riots. It's going to be, oh, you're flying right into the heat of it. And we got there. Trump won. And he won literally everything. The Republicans won the House, the Senate, the popular vote, the Electoral College, the presidency, obviously. And there were no riots because it's sort of just they were so overwhelming. And I remember we sat down with Rob Schneider and he was so happy. Yeah. And there was this time of like, wokeness is over, Ukraine is going to get finished, no more foreign wars, you know, the right's going to be united, we're going to deal with this, we're going to deal with that.

[9:09](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=549) And it's been less than two years. Yeah. What happened? Boy, that's a lot. But enough about politics in general. Let's go back to me. No, I remember that, that election night. And I will tell you the reason that it was so important to me. So we covered the election in 2020. And we covered it in 2016. Then it was the biggest election stream in 2020. And I don't know if you ever have those moments where you go, there's nothing I could do about it, and that was wrong. And it was 2020 when they called Arizona with, you know, like 0.4% of the vote. This is hyperbole, by the way, but it was just far too little.

[9:43](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=583) And I remember going, wow, that can't be right. As far as calling it, I wasn't contesting the result right away, but going, and there's nothing I can do about it. so that's why we made sure going into the next election, because before that, it was sort of like you're a podcast and you're a companion, you know, podcast to, like Joe Rogan would do Fight Companions because it's a pay-per-view. We paid for all the same news wires that, you know, Reuters, AP, they have, and then we also brought on some data analysts, so we were actually able to have more granularity. We were the first place on Earth to call Georgia and Pennsylvania, and I believe we were within, like, a minute of the election.

[10:17](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=617) And that's because I never wanted to sit there and feel so powerless, where I felt like I was still kind of at the mercy of legacy media, and we already knew that they weren't on us. And, of course, I'd gone through, you know, the demonetization, which we can talk about, the Vox Adpocalypse, all of this. So, like, cancel, before cancel culture was coined, I was canceled. Now, being demonetized for saying nothing worse than Lispy Sprite versus, you know, the beat cop showing up at your door in the UK, I mean, I'll take the pay cut. But it's still a symptom of the same problem. So that election happens.

[10:49](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=649) um and i will say look nobody's perfect uh and there have been some disappointments from this administration yep got it but he has done more than any president ever not just in our lifetime for example on immigration that was the primary issue for people um he has done more socially and culturally as far as when people talk about cancel culture i mean we had videos that were literally banned from youtube there are only two genders change things like that so um and it's really tough for me to look at a guy where he he would be in jail he would have been lulid and go like ah he did this wrong i'm disappointed with this let alone i mean i don't want to spend a whole bunch of time on the iran war because it'll just get everyone mad but he said no new wars sure but we actually seldom have a record i can't think of any a track record as long as donald trump's on iran because he was a public figure before he was president and you can go back to the 80s with him saying, I'll nuke them.

[11:46](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=706) They're like, well, he's like, we got to do away with the red. I'm just saying they're the, they're the shittios we have to deal with. And then asking him again in 87 and in 92 and then tweeting about it before it was X while Barack Obama was president. So he's been very, very clear. on that now i think that it's been carried out pretty badly as far as communication i said give it three months well the three months are up not a big fan of how it's been conducted but i also understand the reasoning behind it i don't think that it's a closed-handed issue certainly not this idea that iran is no threat there's a reason that everyone there doesn't want them to proliferate nuclearly nuclearly can you say nuclearly we just did a bunch of george bush impressions and he's sitting there nuclear um so it's hard for me to go yeah let me throw the baby out with a bath water because of something that he's been clear about. People may not agree with him on it, but it's not betrayal. Oh, no, I wasn't. I mean, getting you to slam Trump is not what this is about. What I was actually much more interested. But there are people doing it on that going. Well, he promised no new wars. It's like, well, you could also argue he's trying to put an end to a

[12:46](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=766) war because he's saying people will go, Iran hasn't killed a single American. You dumb piece of shit. Of course they have. Doesn't justify it. There are plenty of countries that, by the way, kill Americans. It happens all the time. When you look at American bases, you look at obviously things that happen covertly, but this idea that he said he was never going to interfere with Iran, that's not true. That they haven't killed any Americans, that's not true. So I think the through line that's really important, and a lot of people have lost the plot, is I'm right-wing, just to be clear. I would actually be further... No, but I would be further right-wing than even people like Tucker, Nick Fuentes. If you were to put me on a scale, you would say I'm further right wing. And I don't shy back from that. Who's a right wing than Nick Fuentes? Well, I won't vote Democrat.

[13:31](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=811) So that's one qualifier. Yeah. And he's not gay. How do you know? I just made a gay joke. That's liable. He was on the show and by the way, had two really good debates. But I'm very, very far right wing. Okay. And I'm a Christian conservative. I'm a nationalist. Okay, fine. All of that. But the basis can't be feelings. It can't be political correctness. It can't be a wish list. It has to be truth. And so sometimes people will say that I'm a demagogue or that, well, you're being divisive. It's not left versus right, man. This is actually what I believe. The right and certainly the Republican Party, they're wrong about some things, quite a few things. Certainly they're prescriptions. The left, as it exists today, in my opinion, is wrong prescriptively about everything, about everything there is no prescription from the left that i can hear where there's any validity and people go what about the war on drugs i go just off you want to what a bunch of black tar hair i want fine but even then it's not a left right issue aside from that what education two to three trillion dollars public education the truth is it sucks uh the border policy immigration 10 to 20 million illegals let's i'm just giving you a general broad strokes number under biden

[14:45](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=885) Well, it sucks. They cost $150 to $450 billion a year to the taxpayer. That's the truth. It sucks. Okay, abortion. Well, the truth is, scientifically, biologically, that's a life. Okay, that's the truth. We can develop our prescription off of that. Free speech, the left doesn't believe in it. They'll say they do. They don't. They say, oh, I didn't leave the left. The left, they left me. It's such bullshit. It's such a cop-out. They've always been anti-free speech. What else can we look at? Changing your gender. You can't change your gender. Wait, that one isn't true. It is. No, it's not. It absolutely is.

[15:12](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=912) So the comedians that I used to really enjoy, people like George Carlin and Bill Hicks, they were the ones who were being arrested and criticized by the conservative side of the religious conservatives. I'm not super interested in having this debate particularly, but it's just that bit isn't true. Bill Hicks aimed it at both sides, though, by the way. He wasn't just a leftist comedian. Bill Hicks' last monologue on Letterman was not released or published because of backlash from Christian conservatives. Because he had gay jokes that sort of sounded like he approved of it. Yeah, but then you also had Sam Kinison, who, by the way, like, people embraced him and he yelled that there were no straight people with AIDS.

[15:47](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=947) There was a time, there was a time when the left believed in free speech and then they stopped, is my argument. But anyway. Politically, no. But as far as individual comedians, sure. But the censorship as a movement silencing voices. now here's the thing uh and i can i can give you some personal examples you can go into a comedy club this has always been the case when i was coming up there was no joe rogan there was no sort of alternative i was a i was seen as a gimmick they would say conservative comedian you could go up and talk about uh you know being spit roasted at a truck stop an orgy but if you went up and made a joke about feminists or about muhammad you could hear the sphincters pucker so it's not about vulgar they're fine with vulgarity but they're not but they're when you were talking When you were talking earlier about blue comedy, I was like, they don't give a shit about that.

[16:32](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=992) They don't care how offensive it is. It's more about people's political views. You've moved on to the left, which is cool. No, no, no, I want to go, but I'm just saying, this is why I am right-wing. The other thing, you can't change your bio... So the truth needs to be the through line. And then if you look at the right, you go, okay, so why is it fractured? Is it based on something truthful? That's not what I see. It's not. When I see people go, and Donald Trump hasn't done anything on immigration. No, that's not true. Yeah. And by the way, he hasn't. And we actually warned against this early on where we said, hey, there are people out there trying to tell you that Obama actually deported more people.

[17:05](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1025) That's not true. OK, because turnaways were counted differently. And don't feed into this because they're going to try and use this talking point against you. We warned about it. And then sure enough, these people on the whatever Marxist right go, yeah, actually, Obama deported more. That's not true. There have been more deportations in any recent administration. Not only that, legal immigration, H1Bs. I mean, no one has pulled more levers than this guy. And by the way, it's been blocked by the courts. And if you don't have borders, if you simply welcome a giant wave of third world immigration and you grant them citizenship, which is what the left wants to do, they want to do away with the electoral college, guess what?

[17:40](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1060) You no longer have a country. So if you don't fix that issue, then no other issues matter. Here's something slightly odd about how most of us think. We'll insure the car, the house, the phone, even the holiday we booked six months ago. But the thing all of that actually depends on, which is you being around to pay for it, most people never get around to covering. If people depend on you, that's worth thinking about. It is not a fun question, but ignoring it does not make it go away. This is why I think today's sponsor, Ethos, is worth paying attention to. Ethos makes getting life insurance fast and easy 100% online.

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[19:20](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1160) Yeah. And the right is now way more divided. There's people who are major figures on the American right attacking President Trump's administration. Tucker's a very good example. And others are supporting. There's this big war over Israel. Like, what's going on? That was kind of the angle of my question. Well, I mean, the only consistent through line that you mentioned, Tucker. Which Tucker? Talking about CNN exclusively only wearing a bow tie every time he's seen in public, Tucker? or the one who's dressing the way that he thinks a fly fisherman should dress like. Right? I mean, are you talking about libertarian legalized black tar heroin?

[19:56](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1196) Actually, Tucker, end war on drugs, but support the war in Iraq, or I was wrong. about that the one who all but kind of endorsed el-sayed but not really which by the way to say that el-sayed is no worse than um than rogers is to say there's no bridge too far for today's left so i don't really know that that's coming from conservatives and here's the other thing i didn't see these same people out there fighting as hard in the mechanism the process that we had to ensure some accountability the primaries i saw it's very easy to go they suck they suck they suck and sit it out. But we've run the numbers, too, on this. And this is what's dangerous about it. If, let's say, God forbid, the left flips the Senate. Now, you know, if that were to happen, and they have both chambers, right? So Republican president, and you could swap them, Democrat president, Republican swap both. There's an 80% chance that Democrats would win in 2028. Here's the other thing. The person who would be run against Democrats is not going to be the Trump that you never got. It's going to be a Romney or McCain, historically, with effectively little to no exceptions. So people sitting and out in protest, you have to ask yourself, who are you handing it

[20:59](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1259) **Steven Crowder:** to? Why is there the fracturing? The only consistency that I see is that the people doing the fracturing have been remarkably inconsistent. All of them. Name any of them.

[21:08](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1268) They've either appeared very recently or they were lifelong liberals or libertarians who switched to MAGA, who switched back. And a valid criticism that I would say to the Trump administration is, you know, they really did buy into it as far as the shows where they would appear. It was it was basically who kissed his ass the most he never appeared on my show um and that's okay he has every right to uh he you know i haven't been to the ballrooms i wasn't there with an epstein you know binder but i was supportive of him and critical of him all the way through the same way now whereas these people were sick of fans he could do no wrong and now he could do no right that to me doesn't it's hard to see that as truthful so you don't think it's ideological You just think this is people flip-flopping because they never had a consistent position?

[21:54](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1314) They haven't had a consistent position. I don't want to attribute motive. I'm just saying that's the only... I try to look for patterns, and the pattern that I see is the biggest people, the tip of the spear there, are people who have been very inconsistent in their views. We have been consistently critical on Donald Trump where warranted and supportive. And by the way, the tough thing, too, now is people just say stuff that isn't true, right? That's the clip culture. I mean, even, and I said, well, you guys got a lot of great qualities, and I like you very, very much. Here it comes. But you'll have people spew bullshit here, and I know you don't have time to fact check.

[22:24](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1344) Well, we can't, we can't challenge everything. No, of course not. That's not, like, Dave Smith was here. By the way, he was on my show. He's a very nice guy. I mean, the best thing you can say about Dave Smith is, like, he's there. He's there. That's Dave Smith. He's there. And he said to you guys that I was a never-Trumper, like, twice. And I was like, what cosmic bunny hole did I fall into? And it's just, I don't know if it's because he's misinformed, stupid, but it's really hard for you guys to fact check that because why would someone lie about that? Why would someone get it wrong? Say it twice. And then these people in new media now, and I'm the person who obviously use new media to circumvent legacy media, they don't correct it.

[23:03](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1383) You know, like, you could tell. You could be like, well, Dave, hold on a second. No, I was never a never- You mean because in the primary, where I didn't support him because in the primary, he was the only one who was a lifelong Democrat, and I said, we don't need to take this risk. And after that, I've been incredibly supportive. And he's like, if you were to correct them, with a lot of these people, it's like rubbing a dog's face in their mess and they think it's a treat. Like, they don't get it. They don't get, you can't just go out and say shit. And that's also why we have a practice where we provide a reference for every single claim that we make.

[23:31](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1411) Even though we do silly, childish bullcrap and jokes and sketches and actually make it a comedy show, if I make a definitive claim, I want people to be able to fact check me. And I notice other people deliberately evading that. And that's always very concerning. Like we said, clip culture. A clip. OK, you got it. But what's the truth? So what do you think is going to be the future of MAGA, Stephen? Because it's really difficult to see where they go from here post-Trump. I mean, is it? I mean, if we're talking like the guy in 2028, it's still going to be the conservative movement. It's still going to be a nationally focused movement.

[24:10](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1450) I still see the tenets being the same, right, as far as strong borders, as far as dealing with immigration. I think now, if anything, you're seeing more of a social component to it because people realize that, you know, you can't fill the void of God that you once had with nothing. I mean, I think you guys see that in the UK, whether you're Christians or not. If you kill God, you don't end up with not God. You just end up with something else wearing God's robe, whether it's Islam, whether it's secular humanism, whether it's environmentalism. These are all forms of religion, if you look at the way that they're practiced. So I don't see the movement changing very much.

[24:45](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1485) What I see it is the candidate best matching up to the conservative America first MAGA movement and not the other way around. Because Trump, in many ways, was kind of innovative for the Republican Party. For instance, things like tariffs. That isn't really a free market policy. So I take your point, but he also, what he did was innovative. I'll go back to that word, because it was broadly right-wing, but it was taking policies from the left as well. No, it was something that had been practiced by previous presidents a long time ago, to be fair. Well, that's when people say, what have you changed your mind on?

[25:22](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1522) And the truth is, I'm probably more racist. And by that, I mean the left's definition. I don't think that everyone can be an American. I don't think that all cultures are equally compatible. And the other thing is definitely trade. Because, you know, I was raised in that sort of libertarian era where I thought, all right, yeah, trade is a great thing because, okay, it raises all boats, great. And then I realized it wasn't fair. Then I realized that the tariffs were being put on us in other countries, and it was really the take advantage of the United States Club. I mean, if you look at the, when people talk about Canada and the tariffs, you know, my silly, I mean, I've renounced my citizenship on the show.

[25:59](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1559) I don't know how I do it officially, but it's such a silly, unserious country and a potential national security threat. We should invade them. But I'm not joking. I absolutely think we should just seize complete control of their border because if you close up the border to the south and Canada does nothing, guess what? You still have a problem. So if you look at, you're like, well, wait a second. These were retaliatory tariffs because you had tariffs depending on the tier up to in the hundreds of percentages. against American dairy, beef, steel, whatever it is, lumber. Why? Well, because if they didn't do that, they would have no industry and they'd be importing from the United States.

[26:32](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1592) So that's one where I've changed my mind,

[26:34](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1594) **Steven Crowder:** where I don't believe in economic protectionism, but I do believe in equalizing the playing field.

[26:38](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1598) Now, I would say that's maybe not the closed-handed issue. The closed-handed issue, I think, that Donald Trump has really changed or made a closed-handed issue is immigration. I think people became very aware of the problem, and that's why the left had to accelerate it. And then I think something that's really important is he's been a lightning rod in highlighting the media bias, in highlighting the culture of compelled language in a way that no other candidate would or could. That's something that I think has changed quite a bit. And I think that will be continued and carried over and expected of whoever the next candidate is, because everything is downstream from culture.

[27:12](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1632) That's what when people say, people go, oh, these people want you distracted with culture wars. Well, what brought Jordan Peterson into the fold, and he wouldn't identify as conservative, was compelled language, C-16. If you tell people, hey, you have to use these pronouns, you have to now agree with this gender ideology, they don't want to have a conversation to the left. They want to own the dictionary. And they want to put you in jail if you don't follow it. And they were on their way. So I don't see those as minor cultural issues. I see those as far more forming of the society we live in than tariffs. But both are important. One is closed-handed.

[27:47](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1667) it and i was watching your content and i advise people to go and watch it it's really great really engaging really funny and you had a video which is woke 2.0 is going to be worse than the original woke yeah i mean the original woke excuse my language it was fucking horrific yeah how can it i mean there was a point when people forget this well all you had to say is men can't be women your twitter account was done my friend it was over it was gone oh yeah how can woke 2.0 be worse than that well how can people say that the left and the right are both the same when again could we do we agree that woke 1.0 was coming from one side exclusively yes politically okay yet people now going it's the same oh who really cares donald trump says there's only two genders well what that does is it makes the conversation acceptable because i was being banned from campus and demonetized on youtube i mean you talk about one uh woke 1.0 i was watching a hearing and senator hirono and stephen father committed hate speech i'm like what the fuck talk talk about surreal where i'm sitting there like and susan wajiski was at the recode conference saying well he didn't violate our policies he actually didn't he didn't violate our policies didn't violate

[28:55](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1735) community guidelines so they demonetized me i said okay that sucks i've had when people misuse the term panic attacks i hate it because i've had two maybe three in my life but i remember exactly where i was yeah so and one of them was when youtube was calling with this vox apocalypse i mean their stock took a nose dive and they demonetized a bunch of history channels because of yours truly sorry about that and uh they called and they were reading off a script they're like and uh after our internal review and the room started spinning because at this point I didn't really have any other primary form of income.

[29:29](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1769) And I'm going, oh, no, they're going to ban me, so I won't be able to reach out to people to build my business. And I laid back on the bed, and they said, and that's why we've decided to demonetize you. And I was like, oh, you're bullshit, and that's it? Okay, thanks, just a few million dollars a year gone. But then it wasn't enough, so they demanded the borderline content rule, the rule that we deal with now that's very opaque, that is known sometimes in the industry as the Crowder rule. It didn't exist before this because they needed to appease the leftist mob more. You have senators and you have legislators saying, well, it's not enough to demonetize them.

[30:01](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1801) You seem quite proud of it being named after you. You are. Look at your little face. If my life is going to be semi-destroyed, I want my name on a plaque. Yeah, yeah. It's like, hey, come on. Yeah, it's like you get a disease named after you. Right. It's like Bruce Wayne with the orphanage. He's like, my name better be on there, Alfred. So, I don't know if he said that. But it would be funny if Batman was egotistical. I mean, he was egotistical. He was a little bit. Yeah. We were talking about him doing stand-up. Like, why aren't you laughing? This is funny. Go on to the next one, Master Wayne.

[30:34](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1834) So yeah, what happened with, I don't know why Michael Caine is in the audience. Get off it. They don't like the racial humour. Do your tranny stuff. Don't work. Was he at one of your gigs, Stephen? Michael Caine. Why do you think you can't hear laughter anymore? I mean, I don't know. i don't even know what this voice is um so yeah this was really really bad woke 2.0 let me explain it to you this way because people don't appreciate how bad it was um if you have children and let's say you tell your child to not do something i don't know don't uh you know don't take cookies when i'm not there but the kid is determined to do it you catch him getting on the counter and reaching it okay he now knows that he's going to be caught that way or she uh he's going to find a way around it so he now has set into his programming all right i now know how to evade the obvious point of detection so i've got to take another route it's going to be more subversive they're not going to say hey you have to you know it's hate speech if you don't use these genders they're going to change it they're going to say yeah we thought me too was too much for example look at that cornell 7 and we had on the show i guess

[31:42](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1902) Now it's Cornell 8, I guess. Is it? What happened? I haven't followed that. We did a bit where we had the Cornell 8 on the show in a letterman's jacket, and he had 8 on his shirt, and he was like, I just watched, I sat there and watched and then watched Storage Wars and went to bed. And now I guess there are 8. But look at how they handled that, right? Because MeToo was rejected. Obviously, rape is bad. I mean, I don't want to speak for you. I think we agree that rape is bad. But then you had people, like even people who I despise, like Aziz Ansari. He is a woke leftist himself. He had a bad date.

[32:12](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1932) Okay, you went to a guy's apartment at 2 a.m., drank white wine, and you're surprised that a short Indian man is perhaps not the most tactful lover. That's not rape. So they go now, they go, well, obviously me too was bad. They go, but this woman was gangbanged against her will and she passed out. In other words, they know that you're going to say, hold on a second, hold on a second. We did used to have a conversation about consent, and they go, we know that people care about consent, so now we're going to change the definition of consent. This person did consent. This person was conscious. This person did try and follow up and have more dates with them, and she was regretful after the fact.

[32:48](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=1968) It doesn't matter. They've changed it now to say, no, no, no, no, no. you can remove and don't you know this you can even consent and reiterate the next day and the day after and two weeks after because that's a trauma response so the conversation used to be well she did consent and they would say well you can retroactively remove consent we rejected it we're like no you can't well now they go well actually it's not real consent it's a trauma response see so they bake it into the woke 2.0 to sell it to you to sell it to unsuspecting rubes as a new bill of goods and uh my concern is that that intersects with people saying there's no difference between the right and the left i mean i was shocked to see how many people who were on the right especially these women with lindsey clancy blaming pharmaceutical companies i was shocked to see how many people were saying this is just all disgusting the cornell seven look i get it an orgy may not be your thing it's not my thing either you know call me mr traditional but it was their thing. What a prude. Well, I have known to be prudish. I draw the line at five or six. I call that the grace gang banger, like the express aisle. But it's baked into it.

[33:56](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2036) They now know how to sell it what didn't work. To expect anything else is to believe that the left is willing to actually correct the past and say, you know what, we went too far, and maybe we should stop pushing this agenda. They can't. Well, what I find interesting about AOC saying woke 1.0 when it was crazy is it implies there is a woke 2.0 coming just by the logic of it right so what is woke 2.0 that's what it is it's just it's selling it differently it's packaging it in a way that doesn't look woke but see we just interviewed David Pakman right who's a left-wing you know progressive YouTube commentator and the moment we brought up trans it was like trans had never happened he basically just went I always thought we just you know gave that issue too much you know it's up to individual sports oh bullshit well i i didn't say it quite like that but okay i like to do you believe him no no no all right good well they just say that except no bullshit well see for me we always whenever we have people on we like to let them express their point of view and with him it's useful for people to see that and i thought he actually made a lot of good points on other things but he probably didn't but this idea

[35:04](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2104) that trans was, like, not a big deal. I mean, it was rammed down everybody's fucking throats for years at a time, and you had to... It's almost like, you know, if you weren't trans yourself, you were violating some sort of requirement. That's how much it went through, but now they're all kind of pulling back. So I'm not sure you're going to bring that one back. I mean, that one was clearly deeply... Of course it will. What, you think trans is coming back? Yes. I don't think it ever went anywhere. Do you think the left is going to say, no no you're right no men no biological no cocks in women's sports do you think they're going to say that i don't think they'll use that language do you think do you think they'll even concede the principle i know no no no they will do what david did which is they'll say oh this was never a big deal gavin newsom did that with charlie kirk right which by the way i was critical of charlie when that happened and uh i said why don't you push back gavin was like of course you know i've never been for that yes he was he absolutely was he was biological sports So they'll just say that they weren't.

[36:02](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2162) That's what I'm saying, Woke 2.0. They'll say, well, no, no, we're not talking about this extremism. They are. It's the same thing when they say, well, abortion, no, we're not zealots. You can't name me. And people get mad when I say this. They go, it's not left versus right, man. It is. It's not only left versus right. But that is the primary delineation in worldviews. And it is the most effective one. I am not going to disagree with any other group more consistently than the left, including by the way billionaires elites jews accountants if you say the left i go okay i'm going to disagree with them on more things than any other group of people if you look at uh the the trans issue you're just talking about uh we were talking about gavin newsom right uh and then what was the question you said something about the pac-man guy the the well i just said i said to i we put the trans issue to him and he was all right that was never you know i never thought that was important we talked about it way too much that's what they'll say uh but then when you have two people with if not two dicks um enlarged love nub at the olympics boxing for the final medal you guys know what i'm saying uh they'll still defend it they still always defend it and

[37:13](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2233) going to the abortion issue they go we're not zealots you can't find one person on the left on the dnc national platform who will put any limitation whatsoever on abortion whatsoever However, all the way up to birth, and then, of course, you had governors and senators, and people when asked, even asked, would you support, for example, some kind of bill for infants born alive? I won't give any comment on that. I'm actually at the point where I believe that what people would view as the radical right-wing view is more reasonable than the moderate left view. Because people say, we're talking about the Democrats, not the woke left.

[37:45](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2265) Okay, name me one person on that platform. One person who ran for president in the last cycle who had a reasonable approach to trans issues. Who didn't believe in trans and kids. Who didn't believe in men and women's sports. Name me one. Last time. I imagine, I don't know much about this, so this is just off the top. I imagine in the previous cycle, you would have had Tulsi and Andrew Yanko, who we've just had on. I don't imagine they would have been for trans and kids. That would have been a while ago, Tulsi. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And she's obviously been drummed out of the core, like Tulsi Gabbard.

[38:17](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2297) So, no, I mean, OK. Kamala Harris. Yep. Biden. Yep. Elizabeth Warren. Yep. Bernie. Yep. Gavin Newsom. Yep. Right now. Tallarico. AOC. Yep. El-Sayed. I mean, aside from, you know, evading the Muslim Brotherhood question, we don't really know everything about his views. So, yeah, it's still what they believe. It's just they are going to attempt to repackage it. They don't move back. Hard to imagine how they'll bring back trans. That's going to be a tough one. Compelled language. Tell me more. They don't go, hey, we want biological men in women's sports. They're not going to say that, right? Because people go, what?

[38:52](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2332) Get out of here. These are the same people used to have the sign that said, no vagina, no opinion. And now it reads like, or whatever is the addendum. So they're not going to say that, but they're going to say, well, yeah, but you know what? It's not right to, it's hate speech to not use these pronouns. It's violating rights of the children. you know, it's basically they don't believe in parental rights, but violating your parental responsibilities and not listening to it. That's what you hear them saying now, that they want to transition. It'll be compelled language like you saw in Canada or you see in Europe.

[39:22](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2362) They say you're free to speak unless you step on the landmines that they have laid down for you, in which case you can be arrested, you can be fined, you can be deplatformed. If they came out and said, we were wrong about that. But not only do they not do that, I saw the democratic socialist, Bernie Sanders, praising Lula. What are we doing here? What does he mean? He doesn't actually, that was the thing, right? It's just, oh, the qualifier is democratic socialism. Well, he doesn't believe in that. He doesn't believe in that. He doesn't believe that Lula is anything other than a corrupt politician. It's a means to an end.

[40:00](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2400) People are Marxists. That is who they are at their core. Now, it doesn't mean everyone who votes Democrat. I'm talking about those in charge of the party. If they can compel language, they will. If they can take away your guns, they will. If they can de-platform you, they will. Why? Because they try. And the only thing that stopped them was alternative media shining a light on information, right? The CNNs, the places don't have a stranglehold, and the Trump administration stepping in. It's no small thing. I truly believe it'll just be more subversive. They'll try and be subtle in the packaging. It's the exact same agenda. Don't doubt it for a second.

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[41:22](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2482) So go make it one. Start your free trial at shopify.co.uk slash trigger. Start your free trial at shopify.co.uk slash trigger. You know where I think the next battleground is going to be? And look, this isn't a hot take. I think everyone can see it. But it's economic populism. It's the ever-growing... I thought you were going to say Ecuador. Yeah, Ecuador. Yeah, let's talk about Ecuador. No, economic problems. His mother's from Venezuela. Yeah, yeah. We haven't mentioned it yet. You can all drink and watch it. Does she hate Ecuadorians? Who do the Venezuelans hate? Oh, my mom hates everybody. Yeah.

[41:54](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2514) You know, South American people hate each other. I know. White people are the least racist people on the planet. My lady is, she's like Brazilian, but was also raised by a Cuban. She's racist to every other Hispanic group. Yeah, and they deserve it, especially the Argentines. Yeah. They're the worst. Well, they all hate them because they're basically white. Yeah, exactly. So I think there's a little bit of jealousy. Not that white is superior, just that they're jealous. And then I also know that Chileans and Peruvians would, like, murder every last one of the other. Yeah, they would do. I mean, you look at the way we behave with each other.

[42:22](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2542) It's all Viva la Revolución. Yeah, it really is. It's like your choice is communist guerrillas or a strongman dictator. And then you're like, all right, we're going to take our chances with this. Do it a couple of decades and swing back. Yeah, and that's basically what we do. It's a beautiful model. It is. It is. But the battleground is economics. But, yeah, so economic populism, the ever-growing disparity between rich and poor. And what you have are the Mandanis of the world going, right, what we need is socialism yeah that seems to me the real battleground as in for the next five and ten years not only in the us but also in the uk as well yeah you guys pretty much already have it though so what do you mean that is there someone is there a bernie there promising more socialism actually yes you can always do more yeah we've now got an islamist party it's very exciting well it's an actual party they don't call it that obviously but they will soon don't worry about it but actually on the economic thing so as we're recording this we've just had the budget not this this won't be super interesting to americans other than the minimum wage is now half of the threshold for paying the top rate of tax okay so 27 000 a year is what the minimum

[43:27](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2607) wage is and at 50 something you start paying the top rate of tax yeah what's the top marginal tax rate there because in quebec the top marginal tax rate is like it's over 50 yeah yeah yeah so it depends how far you go once you get so once you hit 100 grand they actually start taking shit away from you to the point where it actually doesn't make sense for you to earn the next 25 grand so if you're on 100 grand you're better off not earning the next 26 grand a year because you get punished so hard they take everything away from you yeah um so we already have that so i mean that is socialism but anyway uh With economic populism in America, what Francis is saying is that, rather than woke, seems to have been the winning model for Democrats.

[44:08](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2648) Well, yeah, because they're taking that from Donald Trump and from the MAGA movement. But the MAGA movement wasn't socialism. The MAGA movement was, hey, look, you can keep more of your money, and we will... The one thing I think that people don't appreciate about the United States, when we're talking about this, because it matters as it refers to populism, it's going to be very different from the United States than anywhere else in the world. In that you can have, in this country, a free market economy-based populist movement. Meaning you can have a criticism of the current government because you're talking about trillions just in interest on debt, right?

[44:40](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2680) And a lot of it spent, most of it, on entitlements, or I would say the biggest percentage on entitlements. And of course, foreign entanglements, that's a component of it, where you can say, hey, everything is too expensive and we want the government to stop doing this, to stop spending all of this. I don't want to be paying all of this in taxes, and when I go to the gas pump, so that a baby mama with five kids, you know, can be on welfare and chronically poor and collect Fanta on Snap. That can be a populist message in the right here in this country, and it can't be, for example, in Brazil, because we have class mobility here in a way that you don't anywhere else.

[45:13](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2713) That's one thing that I think having... Explain that a little bit more. So what I mean by that, I mean, I think the stat, I'm going by rote, and I know you guys have the fact check come up. We can, no, we can do it better. We can, if you make the claim, we'll fact check it with Venice AI. Yeah. And then it's not, it's not, we got Stephen. It's more like his information. And is there a discount on that, Venice AI? Absolutely. Mm, nom, nom, nom, nom. Venice AI makes a boy grow strong. That's a great ad. What's the claim? I think it's, I think the number is something like 70% of Americans will find themselves in the top 20% of earners at some point in their lifetime.

[45:48](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2748) And your claim is that significantly different from other countries? Yes. Okay. Will you check that? There is more class mobility in the United States. And there's more hope in the United States. So the message from the left is, oh, what? So you think you're going to get the Lambo? You know, whatever. They try and point to a character like Andrew Tate, like, riding to Ferraris like skis. It's like, no, no.

[46:06](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2766) **Steven Crowder:** Americans do believe that they could have a good idea, create a business, get ahead, and support their family.

[46:12](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2772) Americans do believe that because it's also very possible. Well, it's true in America. And people have many, many examples. It's tougher to use Brazil as an example because I was just at the center of an international incident with Brazil. And my woman is Brazilian, which is funny. I was going to change my mind and a lady got mad. She's like, you're a woman. I can't believe. And I came home and she was like just ready to go. They love being, they love you being slightly possessed, the Latino women, just to let you know. But my woman is... That's why Francis is into it. Is he? As opposed to the Asians, they just love to be cold and calculated and, you know, but you give them children.

[46:44](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2804) I will say though, so in Brazil though, Before you make your point, Billy, did you look it up? Was the point 70% of owners will find themselves in the top tax bracket at some point in their life? At some point in their life, I think 70% of it. There's a percentage of American earners who will find themselves, I think, at 70% in the top 20%. You might have it, Lane. Is that the number? Yeah, it's the number. OK. Look, I got my own Venice. It's Lane. Everybody's using Venice. You're not ready for surgery yet, Venice. But yeah, so the point is, if you were to go to a Brazilian shopkeeper and say, like, hey, you know, Bolsonaro, more right-wing.

[47:19](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2839) And by the way, I understand that all parties are corrupt in South America. I mean, you know, you're Venezuela, you know. They go, oh, okay, so for two Jews, I'm going to make more money. You're like, you may not. You may not make more money in Brazil. And the truth is, it's far less likely in Brazil. Because if you were born in the bottom 10%, the odds are you'll die in the bottom 10%. Certainly in a place like India, of course, and it has a caste system. But what you can tell those people is you at least will be saved of the indignities of having to put up a sign, Workers Unite or Viva la Revolution.

[47:53](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2873) You know, it's like the lamb's blood so that the revolutionaries pass over your shop. In other words, you won't have to appease the mob and live in fear. We can put an... Infrastructure and law and order, but you can't really promise them prosperity the same way that you can, the opportunity of prosperity. So you can have a populist movement on the right in the United States that isn't socialism. I don't know that that's the case in many other countries because people don't experience the class mobility and believe in it. And unfortunately, that's been warped to, hey, well, why are there people who are so rich and I'm not?

[48:24](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2904) Well, that was never a right-wing ideal. I mean, if I double the income right now of every single person in the United States, there will be more wealth inequality. But you will be far richer. Would you take that deal? Most people, yes. My primary problem is poverty. And then if the wealth is ill-gotten gain, and you see that as a result of socialism. Look at COVID. That was one of the greatest wealth transfers in modern history, right? In Michigan, you were just there. Couldn't go to a local farmer's market, but I could go to Costco. I couldn't go out on my own boat in the lake, but I could go to a weed shop.

[48:59](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2939) Make that make sense. And so it was transferred to the Bezos of the world, to the Zuckerbergs of the world. And whenever you look at socialism, you invariably see people at the top. Look at Cuba, look at Brazil. These people live high on the hog. So I think there's two different forms of populism in the United States. And Donald Trump wasn't just promising free stuff. Now, he kind of tried that in the last election. He was like, $5,000 if you vote for me, oh, that's a lot of cheddar. You're like, come on, man. This is pandering. But yeah, so I think there is a way to have a battle on that front and not just give people say this wish list.

[49:31](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=2971) In terms of the economic thing, I think there is a stupid version of the argument, which is the billionaires are getting richer while blah, blah, blah, even though they are. But what actually has been happening is because of all the money printing, what has happened is the people who own assets that's not just billionaires actually it's boomers and gen x's and some millennials and obviously in every generation you're going to get people who break out of the trap of it sure but increasingly the people who own assets and have owned assets for 20 30 years are running away from everybody without doing any more work they just happen to live at a time when there's so much inflation and so much debasement of the currency for the last 30 years that all you really had to do you know the genius plan was you had to be a boomer and buy a house for three dollars in in 1970 right that's an exaggeration i believe yeah but well just to be clear did you use my jumping off point as the stupid form of the argument no no no what i'm saying is the left has a stupid version of this okay i feel better about it but but there is a steel man version of the argument which is due to the debasement of the currency and money printing you have a situation

[50:42](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3042) where the asset owners are running away from everybody, not because they invented some new thing that does a thing, not because they created a business, not because they did anything, but because they bought a house for $3 in 1973. Yeah. And now it's worth $2 million. Also, I also appreciate that we can have a conversation where you don't have to be specific about everything and someone's like, you know what? You have a thing that can do a thing like that. You develop a thing that's prolapse. You're like, well, that's not a good thing. Yeah. But we know what you're talking about. I will say, yeah, but not just because of assets.

[51:13](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3073) So if you look at this argument, and it's really hard because the same thing happens with the Israel thing, where people are like, I've been called both a Nazi and a Jew shell in the same day. If we look at this, boomers have a point, and so do Gen Z. So in a couple of ways. Boomers obviously benefit from the tailwind from the greatest generation. okay uh and when they point to a lot of the technological advancements and the creature comforts gen z definitely has that in spades and gen z people can definitely make better financial decisions i mean i i always do coffee at home i just the other day stopped and got a cold bro i was like nine dollars i said do people do she was like yeah i'll come in and do it every day i said like do young people she's like as a monthly young people and i wanted to hit her i didn't of course i wouldn't because it's wrong But it just made me say, I'm like, okay, so this is a component.

[52:03](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3123) But when you go to the necessities, like owning a house, like university, like healthcare, okay, name me any other industries that have been more subsidized or regulated. Like, I had this conversation with my parents. I was like, they were like, well, you know, we have this house. I'm like, yeah, you bought the house for like, I don't know, $300,000, and now it's worth $5 million, and you're surrounded by Indians. Like, let's just be honest about what this is. And same thing if you look at health care. Well, I mean, Obamacare happened. You saw premium skyrocket, right? You're talking about deductibles.

[52:36](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3156) If you look at student loans, I've talked about those people, their eyes glaze over. My debate at Harvard with a professor, you could see he didn't understand it, where I said there's an incentive to make school unaffordable because Uncle Sam's going to make up the difference, right, with these grants. And a big part of that is diversity and affirmative action and DEI and kids who are underprivileged. So I had this. This was a big thing for me. I was at Fox News and there was a debate with, it was either Lanny Davis or Doug Schoen, some like basic white guy entrenched with the Democrats. And this is when we were just facing the housing crash.

[53:09](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3189) And he was, and he was saying, this is not right. You know, this is distinctly, and these Americans shouldn't be evicted from their homes and it's horrible and it's not fair. And I was maybe 22, I don't know. And I said, yeah. I said, did they make those payments? So I said, well, you say predatory lending. I don't really understand how a bank who makes money off of you paying back a loan with interest had like, oh, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to find people who can never pay it back.

[53:34](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3214) **Steven Crowder:** That doesn't make sense unless someone else is picking up the tab, unless you're incentivized or in some cases pressured.

[53:39](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3219) I said, so did the people though, did they make those payments? No, did they have the lowest interest rates of anyone buying a house at any point in time? I said, you know what I don't think is fair is someone like, and my parents had moved back to the States. They were living in a townhouse and they were looking to buy a home. and then it was way more difficult for them to purchase a home. I said, I don't think it's fair for people who've actually saved up. They have 20% to put down and they're facing whatever it is, 10% rates. And they can't get in because of some government policy that requires someone who hasn't made payments on that house for 14 months, however long it is, that they get to stay in the name of fairness.

[54:09](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3249) I don't think that's right. I think the people who can afford and save and responsible with their money should probably have an opportunity at those houses. I walked out and my three biggest influences in life would be David Letterman, Norm MacDonald, and John Stossel. I walk out and John Stossel has, you know, the makeup bib and they're carefully going around a stash. And he goes, hey, you're that Steven Crowder kid. And I go, yeah. He goes, you talk too much. I go, yeah, I saw your thing in Cancun. You talk too much. But you really, so if you talk less and show more, he goes, that'd be great.

[54:39](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3279) And then the guy who I debated, Lanny Davis or Doug Schoen is walking by. He goes, hey, Doug or Lanny. He goes, yeah, he goes, you're fucking wrong. Kid's right. And I just thought, oh, OK. And this guy is brilliant, certainly as far as economics. Like, that is something people need to understand. It's not just because they bought a house and it went up naturally. It has been an artificially manipulated market because the whole thing is, hey, people got to have their home prices go up. That's your nest egg. So when people condemn it, when young people look at that and they go, the solution is more socialism, is more government intervention, okay, they're not asking for that in the areas where costs have actually come down.

[55:18](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3318) Technology, creature comforts. I mean, even far more amenities with rent. That does not build a life. So they have a legitimate claim, young people. Like, it's really hard to afford a home. Sure, in comparison. It's really hard to afford a higher education. Sure, in comparison. Healthcare is unaffordable. Sure, in comparison. You've just listed the three categories of our economy that have seen the biggest pieces of legislation that we've ever seen in our lifetimes. That's how I view it. But I don't think the solution is good. And your argument would be, if you didn't mess with it, it actually worked.

[55:52](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3352) Yeah. I mean, it sounds simplistic, but what do we think happens if people who can't afford a house, they get evicted from a house because they're not making... the payments. You have more houses in the market. What do we think happens if, for example, you allow insurance across state lines as opposed to protecting insurance companies? Well, there's a cheaper plan in Texas and you live in Connecticut. Now you can get the cheapest plan. What do we think happens if schools don't get checks from Uncle Sam and you say, well, I can't afford it. Schools go out of business. Yeah. You've seen their entire business model and price margins change with the increased government intervention so there are ways the government can intervene usually in a regulatory way to protect consumers to protect americans but people you know you're never going to have uh a socialist come in and say hey by the way i don't know you know what's really really cool about the end of this is i'm going to enslave you uh they'll always come in saying it's democratic they'll always come in saying that yeah you can vote us in we're going to do this for you and uh eventually you know the old phrase is that money runs out so i think in

[56:58](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3418) States, you can have both forms of a populist movement. It's really interesting. And where do you see the Mamdani democratic socialists? Do you think they've got real cut through with people in the country? Or do you think this is mainly just a city-based phenomenon? I don't know. I mean, it's one of those things I just like, I don't, because you'll have people who like say comedian and then they like present themselves as intellectuals. Everything I just said could be wrong. But I will make references available for every single claim that I make. I don't think of myself as a genius. I don't think of myself as knowing all this. I think of myself as a student.

[57:28](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3448) And I've studied those topics pretty well. As far as a political prediction with Mumdani, obviously you're going to test it in New York first. How far is it going to go? How far is a guy going to go who doesn't like wearing shoes and eats rice bowls with his hands? I mean, I don't think it'll play well in Oklahoma, but I don't know. Well, his point is about the left-wing economic populism. Well, Bernie was the movement candidate. I focused on Bernie when everyone was focusing on Hillary. I'm like, look, that's going to be the coronation. It's going to be Hillary. But Bernie is the movement candidate.

[57:58](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3478) And we saw a lot of people come over from Bernie to Donald Trump. So there is an intersect. And I think some people are, either because they're simple-minded, I guess, acting like leftist populism is the same as free market populism. But yeah, I think a lot of people are confused, and it's become the same chance as Bernie, you know, the billionaires, which used to be millionaires. But now that he's a multimillionaire with three houses, which, by the way, like, it's so funny. people like aoc has a nice tesla and a nice apartment people go like well you know they live in this system or hassan piker has like you know a rolex or whatever it is which by the way to me is like i don't know that's what's always funny about socialism like i just saw lula wearing a ralph loren shirt what's the line like does someone say like no no it's old navy or less you don't get to work like because that would be considered very luxurious to a lot of people like you say well you can do that but you can't do armani so you can have ralph loren like they can't actually give you a line it's just you have more than them and so they deserve to take it i think it's i mean it's it's theft with a with a publicist that's all socialism is but bernie went

[59:02](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3542) from the you know the the millionaires to the billionaires and he has three houses like that's not one of those things where you go well he needs a car to get someplace like well he needs a summer house okay what about the third one he's like fuck son of a summer summer house in my mind he's gilbert godfrey but like what's the just you don't need that and then we also look by the way people selling you this shit sorry pardon my language but since i know you're probably going to censor it out anyway i don't mean censor edit it out uh we believe in free speech i know you believe in free speech but you know gilbert godfrey yelling out you know i get it i would i would i would cut it out for me too it's like they're the least charitable people on the planet so if you want know who gives most it's conservative christians we know that statistically the biggest indicator as to what i know i keep banging the table the biggest indicator as to who is going to give is are they a person of faith religious and uh do they vote red and there's a book i think was brooks who wrote who really cares we've cited it um people on the left don't because it's their ebenezer scrooge before the redemption i used to get so mad as a kid i said back to

[1:00:12](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3612) michael crane the best one was for muppets uh as a kid people go scrooge if you don't like christmas i'd be like piss off he was a mayor he was a man merrier than any other in the town mankind became his business that's like the fifth gospel like the story is he's redeemed but what does he say before that people often make it seem like he was rich and then he was a socialist he says are there no prisons are there no poor houses my taxes go there so they should make use of it and then once he's been visited by three spirits one of them sexually assaulted him if you read it uh he is like you know what no it's it needs to be voluntary and that's a tenet of christianity is voluntarism to some degree so christians give more individually uh socialists leftists don't that's why they demand it be taken by force.

[1:00:58](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3658) It was the funniest story. Bernie Sanders, there was an actual image of his tip, like at Starbucks, and it was like exactly $1.32, meaning he rounded to exactly 18% on his latte because he's not going to give a penny more, but he's going to vote that you give it all. British people watching this are going, well, you tip for a coffee? You weirdos. I know, that's one thing you guys get right. Yeah. The Brazilian driver, they completely, here it's everything is cheap you not deliver you no cook for me you just hand me the bag it's bullshit like no one understands american tipping culture yeah it's true it's almost arabic actually it is i feel like i'm at a bazaar it's like i feel like i have some barker trying to negotiate with like i'm not trying to negotiate about my hot wings get out of here but your point is actually interesting and i've thought about this quite a bit which is um there's a massive difference between voluntarily giving and thinking the government should take from other people and give it away and and like in europe that version is considered the that's that's empathy it's when you take from these people and you give to these people instead of encouraging everyone to create and then to share with others what they think is the right thing to do

[1:02:11](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3731) Like, I do that voluntarily. My wife and I give money to charity because we want to do that and we think it's better for us and for the people whom we're helping to do that. Yeah. But this flip in mentality is actually a very interesting point. It's also far more effective. I mean, unless you're like Bono, where it's all virtue signal. Remember his one charity? Remember it came out that I think it was quite literally less than 1% of every dollar actually went to charity. So that's the thing. When we did the Live Aid concert, it turns out we basically funded a genocide and a warlord. We're like, whoops!

[1:02:49](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3769) Freddie Mercury sounded pretty good, though, in his last AIDS days, didn't he? So it's one of those things. The left, they view their charity as voting to take from somebody else. And that's another thing, going back to the right. Like, I will tell you this. There are a lot of accounts that have popped up. And, of course, a lot of them are in Bangladesh or whatever other shithole country, which we can say now because Trump did than they are, where they were like, you know what, though? I don't think this is right. Like, people shouldn't... People should be allowed treats on Snap. And we said, well, you're not getting, like, soda on Snap. By the way, one of the biggest recipients was, like, the Coca-Cola company. They lobby for Snap. So you would think this would be this sort of...

[1:03:27](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3807) this confluence of all these issues, like, oh, big corporations, big soda companies, and they're basically robbing from your pocket to pay for a giant welfare state, so the people who don't work are getting Coca-Cola. And then people on the right are like, everyone deserves a treat. It's like, well, okay, fine. Pay for your own fucking treats. Until then, it's government loaf. That's what you get. My view is the chronically poor. And by the way, the Founding Fathers talked about this. It's very important, I think, I think, to delineate, you always have to say that, to delineate between people who've had some tough breaks and the Jimmy Braddox of the world, right, who then wins the championship.

[1:04:00](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3840) Hands back everything that he got from the local public works office. And people who were referred to as the, I believe it was, the vicious poor. If you look at the founding fathers, they talked about those who have no interest in working, who have no interest in contributing, who will sit with idle hands for the rest of their days if given the chance, and they will take from their fellow man. They're like, we do not build an economic system to support those people. Those people will always be amongst you. that's very different from people who need some help every now and then. The problem is the vicious poor in this country have been welcomed as third-world immigrants.

[1:04:35](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3875) And here's the thing. If you want to talk about economic populism as it relates to a big welfare state, okay, you can have a giant welfare state or you can have open borders pick one. That's just reality. People go, well, everyone here is an immigrant. Come on. First off, are we acting like people coming from Ireland and England and Germany, like they were from different planets? They had shared common values in a lot of ways. In most ways, religion, you know, they would learn English when they came here, but they came here with a promise of nothing more than whatever it was, a few coins in their pocket. That's very different from people coming here and immediately benefiting from our public systems more than Americans who work and pay taxes. You have to pick one. The left will never address that issue. They will never address it. They used to address it. The left, well, I'm talking about the UK, used to actually be quite protectionist.

[1:05:24](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3924) Mm-hmm. On immigration? On immigration. Like Bernie. Bernie was the same. That's just because English people are racist. That was a right. They're like, that's a little too brown in this neck of the woods. Do you say neck of the woods there? I don't know. Yeah, we do say neck of the woods. Really? Yeah. Okay, I thought Al Roker was the one who patented that. No. But he also has, like, no neck. Hmm. Fat black guy in the United States. Are you familiar with Al Roker? No. National treasure. Shit his pants at the White House. There we go. Apparently, it's very funny. But we don't understand that reference.

[1:05:52](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3952) Your boys are enjoying it. yeah yeah that's the main thing he told the story he told the story on air he's like i pooped my pants at the white house and he taught and like he told it and it didn't get the reaction that he expected like i think he thought be like ah you pooped your pants at the white house but the reaction was like hey we've all been there as in we made a joke you heard the silence we now know you've been there no we have been to the white house yeah uh but we haven't pooped our pants oh i've never been to the white house and i've never pooped my pants well so i guess that makes me better than you. Interesting. On those two categories. On those two categories. So you were at the center of, uh, of a breaking story. It was about Brazil. Tell us what happened. Oh yeah.

[1:06:31](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=3991) Brasil. Brasil. No, no, no. Uh, well, uh, it was one of those things. So, um, I have a lot of Brazilian fans. I think part of it is because, you know, I used to, I appeared on Rogan when a lot of the fans there early on were fight fans. And then I've done Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu for a long time. My woman is Brazilian. I talk about it. So I had Eduardo Bolsonaro, who's the brother of Flavia Bolsonaro on the show. Then the election happened. I don't know if you believe that it was clean. I don't. It's South American politics. It's not. Yeah, I mean, I know. But even then, like the probability to me is it's not completely impossible, but very, very unlikely that again, I also questioned the 2020 results, which resulted in us being banned or suspended on youtube for a while so then bolsonaro seven hours after losing the election that uh judge steps in maria's who may be the most corrupt man uh in our hemisphere uh seizing or freezing i

[1:07:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4045) **Steven Crowder:** believe uh his passports that he can't leave and the basis for it was something that his brother said on my show the friday before it and all he said was like i mean you can go and watch he's on

[1:07:37](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4057) he's like lula say in the debate and when you when you don't win you lose your immunity i'm coming for you and your family i would personally like for my brother to leave to come to united states because he lula said what he's gonna do he even said i like my opinion because he's a brother and uh that's exactly what happened halfway through that i thought you were going to do a It's a Stallone impression. Hey, you got my passport. No, so, yeah, and I'm sitting there, and I get a text. I think it was Landon Brown, like, did you see what happened? I'm like, what? They go, oh, he sees Flavio's passport.

[1:08:13](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4093) I go, oh, why? They go, well, because of what his brother said. I said, what did he say? He's like, you dumb shit. He said it on your show. I'm like, oh, what he said on my show? Really? Where he said, I personally would like to see him not stay? That's, and then, again, tie that back. every single mainstream democratic socialist and a lot of moderates praising it i haven't heard a peep of jailing your political opponents i haven't heard a peep about the political persecution it'll be interesting to watch because we're recording this right after that's happened but this will go out probably on november 4th so by this point maybe one leftist has anticipated this and has come out maybe and jumped in front i doubt it well let's find out i mean it i really doubt it let's find out you know why not because the left is stupid uh i this is one thing in you know having debated there at fox news when i was young and appearing on hln bbc quite a bit sky news all of that and then there was no like sit down and have a conversation the term prompt wasn't used before i did change my mind like that's what started all that uh and anyone can come up and talk um i've noticed that and this is a consistent pattern you'll find exceptions but this is the

[1:09:27](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4167) pattern that's uh the left is they very readily attribute intent evil intent to the right and they are not able to steal man the right whereas the right they are far more charitable as far as intent i think they need to be less charitable certainly in this day and age uh but they are able to steel man the left. That's a big difference that I see. Like that debate that I had at Harvard, I mean, it only took finally offering $10,000 to the Ivy League schools because people say, well, why don't you debate someone qualified? Well, okay, send me someone. We had someone who's been tenured since 1989.

[1:10:04](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4204) And I was finishing his phrases. Now, I'm not, like I said, I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but why was I able to, with a professor who's from, he studied at Princeton, Yale, Oxford, clerked for Thurgood Marshall, wrote books on DEI and affirmative action, and he's talked about freedom of speech on campus. He's had debates with other professors. And you can go back and watch, and as he goes on to make his point about affirmative action, he's going, and so long as it's not, and I go, invidious, and it's this form of, okay, so long as it's not, I'm finishing his phrases for him. And he goes, yes, yes.

[1:10:40](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4240) And he didn't even reroute because he had no plan B.

[1:10:43](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4243) **Steven Crowder:** He had never encountered the arguments that I presented.

[1:10:47](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4247) This is the hallowed halls of Harvard. If you were to ask someone on the right today, generally, you'll get stupid people on both sides. But if you were to ask someone on the right, okay, what are you, are you pro-Second Amendment? And they say, yeah. What would the argument against that be from the left? Most of them would tell you, I don't know, they'd probably say, you know, if it saves one life, they probably would say you're more likely to have a gun used against you that was written during a time of muskets. They'll be able to give you the arguments. If you ask someone on the left, yeah, what is the person who is pro-gun?

[1:11:14](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4274) They'll go, that's just because you're a gun-toting redneck, very often. If you were to ask someone on the right, and I've done this because I've sat down with, at this point, many hundreds of them, say, okay, are you pro-life? Yeah, I'm pro-life. Why? Well, because I believe that life starts at fertilization and, you know, it's separate genetic code, DNA from the mother of... Okay, what do you think the pro-choice side says? Well, they would probably say it's her body, it's her choice, you know, and it's some form of oppression. Okay, what would they say about freedom of speech? You can ask them, they'll go, well, they'll probably say hate speech and stuff.

[1:11:43](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4303) What would they say about socialism? And people will go, well, they'll probably ask about roads and fire departments. If you ask people on the left, they won't present to you a valid form of the right-leaning argument. They're not interested in it. So, yes, we do have silos, but only one side has a violently... aggressive echo chamber that prevents people from stepping out of it and i would ask you to even because you'll have a big sample size do that just ask especially average people who maybe aren't necessarily political ask them to steel man their opposition i would say it's a ratio of about 10 to one people on the right can do it and then they're far more charitable of intent to the left the left thinks that people on the right are evil they support violence political violence more than people on the right we all watch what happened with charlie kirk and that's not the only one That's the one that you saw get through.

[1:12:30](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4350) That's been my experience. So I don't think. Why do you think that is? Well, I know why it is for the generation like millennials. So, and this is when I wrote the book that was called something else because the term SJW wasn't even a thing yet and woke wasn't a thing yet. And it was turned down from every major conservative publisher. It was basically changed my mind, but with chapters on it. is, let's say, a millennial person, born, you know, I was born in 87. Say someone born somewhere between 85 and the early 90s. Lives the average American life. They go to public school. They turn on MTV network news, right?

[1:13:10](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4390) The bands they listen to. They go to university. If they come out of that conservative, they have had to defend their view every single day of their life. There are no exceptions. The leftist, the liberal from my generation, would accept everything by default. And that's why I think it's very important to delineate between those who've accepted the default cultural position and those who are the manipulators, right? The propagandists of set positions. So it's impossible to go through life, and I would say this probably with most generations, it's impossible to go through life as a young person and be right-leaning or conservative and not have to think about why because you have to defend it.

[1:13:46](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4426) The left never does. So the left, they never actually have to grow out of that 14-year-old girl going, save the whales do you want to sign it that's just give them a seat and you've got aoc remember the green new deal it was 11 pages and it was like and cookies and cookies it was everything there it's just like and by the way equity for the whole economy like what the fuck how do you just put this all in there i thought this was about fossil fuels so that's why people on the right have had to defend their view may change now with the fragmenting of media um well actually it's interesting so i was going to agree with you there and in fact i think uh in in large parts That's why the left is so culturally dominant, because the right has to argue for its ideas.

[1:14:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4465) The left just imposes them through the education system and all the rest of it, to the point where people think that's the default position. And actually, it's interesting. So people like us who don't really identify as either left or right, particularly- Oh, stop it. Go on. Stop it. No, I don't want to go on. I just wanted to say, stop it. Oh, okay, fine. Then the moment you stray from the left- Correct. Right, point us to the left, you might as well be. You acknowledge that, right? To the left, they would say right-wing. Yeah, but I reject their right to define my politics. I know, but they would.

[1:14:54](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4494) I don't give a fuck about them. But here's my point. I agree with you. You're not necessarily right or left, okay? Do you think that someone on the left would agree with your statement? They would say, come on, you're right-wing. No, of course they don't. Of course they don't agree with you. Exactly. Of course. And by the way, a lot of people on the right don't either because they want to co-opt us to right-wing. And, you know, that's flattering in some ways, whatever. But my point was that if you say to a right-leaning person, well, actually, I disagree with you about this and this and this. They go, oh, that's fair enough, but I'm glad we agree on X, Y, Z, right?

[1:15:23](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4523) If you say to a left-wing person, like, well, I kind of think this is true and this is true, but I don't agree with you, then Nazi is what you get. Right. That's your point. Yeah. But you talk about the fragmentation of the media. I mean, one of the things that I have to say has been mind-boggling to me, and I think this happened particularly after the murder of Charlie Kirk, it went into, like, complete overdrive, is, like, I don't... I genuinely don't understand, like, the ritardo sphere that's been created on some commentators on the right in the new media space, the Candace Owens, Tucker Carlson phenomenon.

[1:15:57](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4557) Oh, okay. I was going to say, this is interesting because, like, you have the, I love how you have the- This sort of formal lighting, and you have what I call the Protestant church backdrop. Every Protestant church, like, God wants me to be happy. This is in the background. But we have that, but we can also combine it with new media, like, hmm, explain retardosphere. Yeah. Well, I just did. You just gave me a few names. Yeah, but of what people are doing. Coming up with these crazy ideas that have no bearing on reality. Winston Churchill is the greatest villain in World War II. Charlie Kirk's wife killed him, or he killed himself, or the, you know, president macron who's a man killed like what is that israel was behind the uh was behind venezuela and taking maduro i thought that was a french legion it's both it's both it depends but they were transported by the egyptian but it's like and entertainment i get and alex jones was perhaps someone who was doing this kind of stuff for a long time but it just seems to be like more of it but what's weird to me but alex jones actually did believe what he said and alex jones was right on a a lot more than these people are.

[1:17:00](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4620) He was wrong on some, but Alex Jones was very, like, Alex Jones, when he said, like, you know, he went to Guatemala and South America and we knew that they had syphilis, gonorrhea, and we just let them get infected. Like, we just let them have boils all over their balls. And we're like, and then you're like, oh, Hillary Clinton apologized for it, where we basically allowed disease to spread. And the frogs were turning gay as well. They were turning, at the very least, asexual. Asexual. Yeah. Yeah. So he was, so my point is, like, there's something there. But here's my point. But I came to the Alex Jones phenomenon quite late, by which point a lot of it was pretty wacky.

[1:17:30](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4650) But I just looked at that and went, okay, that's what Alex Jones does. So I therefore know what to make of that. But if Alex Jones was like the number one anchor on Fox News, and then like two years later, he's this, then I'd have questions. Yeah, and this is why I said, I think the anchor, it has to be truth. It has to be truth. And we have a process for determining truth. Notice that the only institutions at the left they want to do away with are any of the processes or institutions that may determine truth. So, for example, like the justice system. They just say, well, actually, it's completely unjust, and they insert some bullshit statistic here.

[1:18:07](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4687) You know, the same principle applies to innocent until proven guilty. If you look at math, or you look at, for example, teaching logic and reason in classical Greek fashion, they say that's white privilege, and they demand that those courses be changed. So the mechanisms that you need to decipher, to give you discernment, which i think is very important that's what all wisdom is is discernment the left seeks to destroy so when you say that so many like broad strokes but uh i apply the same standard to that as i do to myself and i do to anything else okay well what is the evidence that's what we need okay what is the you are make if you're making a claim you're asserting this what is the evidence and for everything that you just mentioned the answer is none there are assertions there is no evidence that's why i'm asking why is that happening because because bitches be crazy let's be honest It's a bunch of true crime, silly bitches, the same people who believe that Lindsey Clancy's husband did it, even though that man was a saint, by the way.

[1:19:02](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4742) They're the same people who believe that Erica Kirk is part of some kind of underground satanic cabal, and they have the same amount of evidence for both of them. It's not the conservative audience. It's not the right-wing audience. It's a bunch of people who are just looking for a reason to stir up shit. There is zero evidence, none whatsoever, that Lindsey Clancy's husband did anything other than, take parental leave, work from home, hire a nanny, fire a nanny when she didn't want the nanny, and go pick up dinner and a prescription for her or the children while she plotted to murder the children. His greatest sin is that he moved on. Now, people say that's too fast to move on. I don't know. I'd move on pretty fucking quickly if a lady killed my kids, right? That would be in my rearview mirror. Same thing. There is zero evidence whatsoever to many of these baseless can pick one hey if there's evidence for it great but there's some here's the thing some people have no interest in it like they'll go you know 30-06 uh It always... No. No, that's just not true.

[1:20:03](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4803) It's not true. It depends where the shot was taken. Depends on the kind of bullet. It depends where it hits. Now, you can say it's unlikely that a .30-06 would react this way, but my uncle has taken deer many years with a .30-06 and doesn't have an exit wound. Bullets do weird things. That is not a... You know who else got taken out by a .30-06 and didn't have an exit wound? Martin Luther King, Jr. Another one that went through here and then it hit his clavicle. Can we just stop? because he said that it should basically vaporize them like a Ridley Scott film. So this is where, then we move on to another one, whether, what, the Egyptian plane thing, the French Legion, and people don't apply the same filter or the same process.

[1:20:40](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4840) You do need to apply that equally. Now, my lens, obviously, of the world is more conservative, Christian conservative. I acknowledge that. But I need to recognize if I have a blind spot. So I always try and look into something and I always try and steel man the opposition. I have tried to do it with these conspiracies. there is there really is nothing there there is nothing there and if you look at the audience base it's usually um it's it leans very heavily female on people who are into true crime that's a big part of it to act like this is the same overlap of a huge percentage of trump voters it's just it's just not well that's actually a good explanation and i think this is where i said uh you know if somebody who was doing serious stuff then pivots into this that's perhaps the confusion right do you see what i'm saying yeah uh because it if someone is doing true crime where you go i don't know this is kind of entertaining to watch who knows what's true blah blah blah but if it's sort of presented as a truth claim by someone who used to make truth claims that used to be true that's the point at which but they haven't though yeah tell me more well which people have made truth claims that happen to be true i thought candace owens was absolutely

[1:21:50](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4910) fantastic at regurgitating Thomas Sowell talking points about the BLM and all that kind of thing. She was very good at selling that to a different audience. I disagree. That's all. I disagree. He disagrees. I think you could go watch her interview with Joe Rogan a very long time ago. There's a reason that he didn't have her back. Obviously people know she was a lifelong liberal and she sued with NAACP and she created social autopsy to dox conservatives i'm sure you're familiar with all of this uh and uh yeah so uh the only consistent through line with all the people you've mentioned is that they've been remarkably inconsistent it would be fine i know that people can be left see the light and go to the right but when someone goes left wing right wing left wing right wing yeah but none of this is something that's really like like falsifiable verifiable none i i you just have to at a certain point ignore it as white noise until you get to evidence so that's why i say the through line has to be truth and it's not just them by the way i talked about this there are very few people i dislike more in the entertainment industry than alan richmond the jack reacher guy uh sorry my stomach's growling so i'll probably go grab something to eat a little bit but um and and

[1:22:59](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=4979) and it's not because i know him personally i dislike him even though i don't know him personally because he first off he goes out and he tells christians that they can't vote for trump and i don't know he was like the epstein list you know the epstein list i would have that shit on lock I'd be like, bitch, get out of the way. And he's just so delusional. And he also said he gained 30 pounds of muscle at 40 completely naturally in six months, which I don't know if it has happened zero times in human history. So that. So my point is I really don't like him because he acts like a stud, but he lives like a bitch.

[1:23:31](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5011) But then there was this article, we did a whole segment on it. It has like a million plays, I think, where there was this article, Alan Richson, teary-eyed, talks about finding out that his son or daughter was not his with the paternity test. And I will tell you, it happened, and I said, like, a quiet prayer because you're supposed to pray for people you don't like. I just, like, no one should have to go through that. It's completely made up. It's completely made up. And the reason that I thought, well, this must be true is because it says in this clip, and it's a clip of Alan Richland, you know, talking...

[1:24:00](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5040) those t-shirts that are like always cut out like here like they can't fit their head through it i don't know why that's all he wears and he's talking about some uh show that he worked on is zero to do with his divorce zero to do with a paternity test and it has like two million in reach and then you have the same thing with tom cruise cutting off his kids from his will and these things just go up go up go up and they are completely fabricated so there is a huge cottage industry right now and the tough thing is as someone who the one kind of claim that i i i can make is that I've been here the longest. I've been in this space the longest. There were no conservatives on YouTube. You can go back and see with a blue bed sheet and a digital eight cam quarter. And it used to be the internet was a place where we could sort of bypass the gatekeepers.

[1:24:46](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5086) I used to watch Joe Rogan, his very first shows, it was, you know, webcam in his den. He's like, yeah, we don't. I watched him. He was on Tom Green Live, which was a show in his living room. And Joe Rogan was like, this is, this is the future. You could see the wheels turning where he was inspired by it and saying, hey, we don't need, you know, these people, we don't need to have a big expensive studio, right? So the idea was, hey, we can reach people directly without the agents, without the managers. And we know that legacy media feeds slop and dishonesty. So that was kind of the first wave, right? And we were still figuring it out as far as making it professional, but not making it too slick. And then something changed at the same time that the legacy media realized, okay, cable news isn't the thing. So they just dump a bunch of advertising dollars into YouTube so they get favorable algorithmic treatment, people online just say, you know what? I'm going to just make stuff up. Because the truth, here's where we went.

[1:25:35](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5135) The legacy media, I think we both agree, CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, right? Pretty dishonest. A lot of lies.

[1:25:42](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5142) **Steven Crowder:** The truth was more interesting than the lies. It was novel. It was like, actually, what you were told isn't really true. And like you mentioned, Thomas Sowell, right? Like you mentioned,

[1:25:50](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5150) talking about socialism. Some of my early videos in the Second Amendment, things like that. Okay? so that gained traction and now we're at the point where here's the truth that people have been used to well that's kind of old hat and the lies are more interesting than the truth jack reacher paternity test wife cheated on him with a black guy i added that but the point is you know they just have to make it as salacious as possible and that's a huge industry at this point so that's something where we're going to have to deal with and people are going to need to have tools to be more discerning but we went from the truth more interesting than the lie and now the lie is more interesting than the truth.

[1:26:23](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5183) Well, how do you compete with a lie? How do you compete with a lie that if someone makes it up, you go, like in other words, I go, hey, no one ever in the history of the world has gained 40 pounds or 30 pounds of muscle in six months. It's not possible. So someone's saying that's a story. You can talk about it and you can show some studies and go, this is what you expect. Okay, that's pretty interesting. It's not as interesting as Alan Richson gangbanging at a sex club, but that's not true. But that'll get more clicks. And if you apply that to the other folks that you mentioned, people in the media sphere like it's not as though this is something that we don't all see and uh you know community notes aren't cutting it because people see it they go well why would someone lie they have a quote attributed to this clip so clearly it's in the clip and you click the clip and it has nothing to do with it well there's two other things as well which is number one the the mainstream has destroyed fact checking as a thing because like we have bbc verify in the uk the like tells you whether a claim is and you're like well they keep lying in that number one the other thing is is that what jubilee copied with their fact check i don't like fact check men are

[1:27:24](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5244) bad okay um and the other thing is actually responding to this stuff amplifies it which is what these people use to get more attention for the same yeah as well so it's a it's a challenging one to solve it is i mean we do have rules for libel slander like i don't again i think people are grown-ups yeah where some people yeah myself not included but uh i think people can delineate between for example doctors who are currently practicing during covid saying we're seeing promise with ivermectin or hydroxychloroquine you know combined with zinc and we're seeing patient outcomes better and they Give you a sample size of thousands of people. I think people can see the difference between that being removed at the behest of the government, and someone, you know, just saying, hey, Johnny Depp is turning into a woman. Right? Where you can go, well, that shouldn't be allowed. Not censoring speech, but like, like, if something is verifiably, like, immediately verifiably untrue. Okay, like, if YouTube can algorithmically suppress people who aren't monetized, you mean to tell me that someone is making something up knowingly, and they have a pattern of doing it?

[1:28:29](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5309) those accounts shouldn't be there that's not anti-free speech at all and i'm a free speech absolutist people say you can't yell fire in a crowded theater well sure you can of course you can there's a fire where you think there's a fire you can't yell fire to cause a stampede people don't even understand that case that that statement's often based on but even before we get to that it's like people need to do a better job themselves and i have a few things that i advise people if you watch someone and they don't provide references on a regular basis for factual claims that they make uh you should probably move on to someone else i think that needs to be a standard we've been doing it for years it's a bibliography every single show we have an admonish button for us in show if we get something wrong um and if people don't have some i know you guys had the fact check that you said uh if people don't even attempt that you can't trust them and then i think we people need to be more more discerning um we're in an era where this is really scary i definitely think for young people where everything's a short and a short and a short not only attention spans are they shorter but you have people who i don't even know if they assume everything they read is

[1:29:30](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5370) true i think they just don't care that's such a good point because what this is for those people is entertainment like you talk to them i know some of these people i go why do you listen to candace and they go yeah but she's really entertaining and it's fun and you go well at that point what are you actually getting from it are you just getting a soap opera yeah or are you getting somebody else who's trying to educate you but the thing is there is nothing wrong with a soap opera as long as everyone involved knows it's a soap opera yeah the issue i have with it is it's truth claims is soap opera presented as truth also i think that mexican soap operas need to label it they're mexican because everyone just looks like white people that is a very very good joke that goes back 20 years in my memory i haven't seen a mexican soap opera for at least 20 Yeah, it's just they just look like what it looks looks like you two. Yeah, but but that's the thing. It doesn't matter The age of a person if they're from Latin America, they will watch that shit. Yeah, and it is shit Yes, it is the worst acting you have ever seen in your life. Oh my gosh I mean I can do that Canadian acting can be pretty bad

[1:30:38](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5438) It's funny because the talents that come to the States are great and in comedy. They're disproportionately represented but like if you watch canadian tv let alone french canadian tv you have some standouts it's the worst most obvious sense of humor like you know someone like a funny tie and a paper mache hat or some you're like this but they're french they can't do yeah no i know but canadian acting is very over the top uh but yeah it should come with a warning because i don't know if i'm watching a mexican soap opera or any other soap opera because they all look white so canadians are white mexicans is what you're saying yeah effectively only they're more of a national security threat yeah but the food isn't as good in canada yeah do you have any food in canada no i don't They've got poutine.

[1:31:13](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5473) It's just chips and gravy. Oh, stop it. You guys, you're from the place with the worst food on earth. Hey, listen. We do a great curry. No, no, no, no. We do a great curry. This is my area of expertise, right? You're going to tell me about a great curry? No, no, no, no. We have the best desserts in the world. That's fact. Factually correct. Fact. Let me guess. A pastry, put some cream in it. In my clothes? In my fucking clothes? Listen, we're in Texas. It's sticky toffee pudding. There's a gun over there, and I'm going to shoot you. On that happy note. First off, I don't know if he's allowed to have a gun, But you know what?

[1:31:43](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5503) I accept it. Fine. We actually have the best food in Montreal. A lot of people don't realize Montreal. That's the one silver lining there is the multiculturalism and what an awful place it is. Like, bagels came through Montreal before New York. People don't realize that. Yeah. Well, on that happy note, Stephen, great to have you on the show. That's it? that's it unless you got more i thought you do the whole thing where you do uh like the speed i mean i always have more we do the speed the speed yeah yeah well this guy i thought he just took a bump when he was just like no no again on desserts that's just ad on desserts uh i always thought you guys do like uh what is it the speed round and no we do uh what what's the one thing we're not talking about which we're about to do and then we go to triggerpod.co.uk for people's questions than we were just sending.

[1:32:26](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5546) Oh, OK, OK. Well, let me leave it before you do that. One warning. Oh. Go on. Oh, yeah, you wanted to give us the mug. Oh, yeah, that's right. I did give you the mug, just because, you know, look, your mugs are nice, but I mean, if you- Don't start with the fucking mug. My mug is empty. No, no, no, take that butt back. And then, because you have to compare it, like, wait, and this is hand etched. And like, this is what kept us afloat when we were demonetized and canceled. Oh, that's heavy. Yeah, and it's hand etched. One side though, they couldn't afford to have the other side edged. No, actually, that's the classic one that didn't have both sides.

[1:32:53](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5573) So I gave you something vintage and you shit all over it. But thanks. We're grateful. But you started a bit of a row and we got it finished. It's not a row. It was just offensive. What does row mean? A row. Yeah, it's where you say, sister? R-O. It's our fucking language. Yeah. Well, fine. You get defensive about desserts. Yeah, but you grew up speaking French. Yeah, I didn't. Well, first off, I grew up in Detroit, which also isn't America. And they don't speak English yet. Is it row? Yes. R-O-W. Yes. A row is like a fight. Is that an expression that we use in the States? Row? It's row. Oh, okay.

[1:33:29](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5609) I get it now. Row as... No, that's... That's... That's that. They caused a row. See, you know what? I'm glad you had a fucking revolution. Anyway. Yeah. I'm glad that we got away. Yeah, me too. What were we saying about the mug? Come back. How do we bring this back? No, that's what kept us afloat because we knew that we were going to be demonetized. Interesting fact, i was waterboarded as part of a christmas telethon and you feel that hand that etching like it gives you grip and the signal when i wanted to stop being waterboarded they taped my hands i was actually waterboarded by you know marine uh navy seals and uh some army rangers they put that in my because i can't talk so they put the mug in my hand people can go watch it and the signal was supposed to be i tossed the mug for them to stop but the problem is the mug was clamped in my hand too tight and it's on there and i literally couldn't toss it didn't they did that on purpose steven well they could have yeah i definitely didn't i thought i could beat it like i stuck my tongue out like a tent i was like and then uh yeah so it's my point is this is you know it's very uh you know it's it's nicer than yours but it's also uh very much just a a token of appreciation

[1:34:36](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5676) i'm so glad that people like you are around too like there weren't many early on i mean there were no conservatives on youtube and there were there were no right-leaning people freedom-minded people just dominated by edgy atheists and i appreciate you guys are willing to have conversations with with everybody um sometimes it gets heated and that's always really fun because i can see your eyes shift a little bit where you're like this mother but you still keep it bright see i the thing it's interesting you mentioned that because i definitely know my eyes go like that but they i only really see we really genuinely are interested in everyone's perspectives now some people's perspectives are crazy and wrong but it's worth having the conversation when i get uh when i go hard at people is when they break the rules of the conversation the rule of conversation is you talk i talk and we engage with what each other is saying yeah some people don't do that what they do is dodge interrupt and and i have to say our recent experiences are pretty consistent which is it's only the progressive left that really does that uh with everyone else you can have a discussion uh but we're going to keep doing we're going to

[1:35:37](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5737) keep inviting people on from all over the spectrum because we think there's value on that and by the way if you want to talk about you know getting to the truth interrogating each other's ideas and ideas from across the political spectrum is worth it for that reason it's i think it's why uh change my mind works so well because that is a discussion about the ideas ultimately now it's entertaining and some people are retarded and blah blah blah We're allowed to say retarded now, too. Yeah, we are. You're welcome. It's always been my favorite word. Because we were suspended. Isn't it fun, too, the lawsuit to a change of mind?

[1:36:08](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5768) That's going to be, you know, watching that on CNN. They did Jubilees Change My Mind with James Tallarico. And by the way, a lot of people have copied kind of the format and stuff. Like, people go, well, you can't trademark debate. No, no, no, no, no, no, I'm not. If I were to go out and AI creates two of you, Constantine and Francis, and have a set like this and call it trigonometry, that would be a problem. Not people just sitting down and having a conversation, let alone a novel format. But it's just funny. They had the same font and color. And it's like, I was just thinking about it. CNN, the most trusted name in news, literally couldn't come up with a name.

[1:36:43](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5803) They just had to take it from someone else. That shows you that legacy media is largely irrelevant. And I'm hoping that as, it's not really new media now, but I guess you would just say online media. I'm concerned about the direction. Two reasons. One, the left are Marxists, and that is something that I firmly believe I warn against it all the time. If you want to understand the left, look at everything through the lens of Marxism. Who's the oppressor? Who's the oppressed? It's the only way you can make sense of it. It's the only way you can make sense of an LGBTQ flag, but then also a free, you know, from the river to the sea.

[1:37:14](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5834) It's the only way you can make sense of the logical inconsistencies. They view the world through the lens of Marxism, and I absolutely, when people say we need unity on the right, what does that mean? To me, it means fighting the left. And I know people say, that's just fear-mongering. Okay, that's what needs to be unified, is fighting the left because anything they touch, they destroy. And I'm hoping that as we move forward, we see all this fracturing stuff going on in online media. I'm hoping that shows like yours went out and not, you know, like the clickbait stuff that we were talking about.

[1:37:45](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5865) And I'm not just talking about those hosts, but the same thing that you see on X and Instagram and the real culture. Like, we are looking at a fork where the internet could continue to be a really cool place that renders legacy media irrelevant that part has largely happened or dead internet theory could become a reality and that's that's scary so i hope you guys you know keep doing it well thanks man but it's also up to people i mean the reality is and you we've come all the way full circle to the start of the conversation podcasts are now i know a lot of people in our space that literally sit down and plan out the podcast conversation down to every single question and they're like and i'm gonna ask this because that will create this clip and so now i thought this whole space was for this right yeah long-form conversation agree disagree discuss then bring someone on from different but now we're getting into clip culture 2.0 like woke 1.0 now we've got clip culture 2.0 where people are going into a long-form conversation to create a clip so that they can go on and it's so easy to do yeah like look ask me okay well let's do a little thought exercise here ask me a question any question i'll show you i'll show you how if i wanted to be a charlatan um like if

[1:38:58](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5938) i wanted to be dishonest assuming you believe that i'm a what do you think about the iran war do you mean the iran war that was orchestrated and funded by the jews now you do one are you optimistic for america i would be optimistic for america if we weren't beholden to and controlled by bb net and yahoo it's super fucking easy to do it's just anyone can do well what i find funny is that Nick Fuentes was like the Israel derangement. So like he was saying there are people now who have Israel derangement syndrome. I know, yeah. Which actually is your point, which is once people catch on to the fact that something, some retarded idea gets attention online, then everyone starts repeating the retarded idea.

[1:39:38](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=5978) That's what pisses me off more than anything. Yeah, well, it's just really easy to do. Okay, let's do it with Charlie Kirk. Go ahead and ask me a question because we've talked about these big things. Did Erica Kirk kill Charlie Kirk? Well, I am not saying that she killed Erica Kirk, But isn't it odd that she wore leather pants at his funeral and the person who came out and signed a sworn statement, not in court, mind you, said that Erica Kirk planned to kill Charlie Kirk? what do you say to that person whose name I can't give you and whose face I can't show you? Right? Anything. It's way easier.

[1:40:08](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6008) Your jobs would be way easier. I've been doing what I do for a very long time, and people can say I'm stubborn. I'm not going to change it, but that is what you're up against. And it's super, super easy to do. And that's why you see a bunch of Johnny-come-latelys going, oh, great. So when you're like these people who maybe espoused facts before, there are some of those, and there are a lot of people who just popped up and they're doing exactly what I just did with you. Well, maybe that's a better way to think about it. It's just entertainment for people who want that. You know, it's not actual factual discussion, but that comes back to your point, which is individual people who watch stuff are going to have to make a decision.

[1:40:45](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6045) Do you want to watch things whose mission is truth-seeking or do you want to watch entertainment? 99% of them will choose entertainment. Well, and the funny thing is our show is, I mean, I don't know if you've seen, Like, we brought in several metric tons of sand to do a parody of Saving Private Ryan. We had a parody of Darkest Hour, like There Will Be Blood. We have at least four or five sketches. I mean, our overhead is millions of dollars because we created a television show online as opposed to most podcasts are radio. Again, my influences were people like Letterman. So it is far more entertaining, and we treat people like adults who can understand the difference between, you know, Josh doing a George Bush impression calling the states on election night and a factual claim that I make.

[1:41:26](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6086) And that's why we provide overlays. And that's why we try and give people references. But, you know, okay, doing this before we go to the questions here. The Israel thing. I'll just say, this is my, because I get called both an anti-Semite and a Nazi in the same day. Okay, this is my perspective. And it has been for pretty much all of my adult life. I even said this to Ben Shapiro going back, I don't know, 2016. I didn't get into depth. I said, but you know what? If we just stopped sending any money over to that area of the world, Israel would actually come out ahead. when you add up all the money that we send to people who want to wipe them off face them out is that a reasonable policy they go yeah i think that's actually reasonable and then uh my position is hey israel has some motives that sometimes are not aligned with the united states and the united states would have some motivations that sometimes aren't aligned with israel and then quite often there is overlap because there are similar groups of people who want to kill both of us And so the simple approach forward is no money, no blank checks to Israel.

[1:42:27](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6147) I don't think we should be sending the amount of money. If they want to make some purchases, when convenient. If we want to exchange intel, okay, great. But we shouldn't be tied at the hip as a matter of policy. And let the cards fall where they may. Iran is a good example. They have motivations. We have motivations. Sometimes they are congruent. Sometimes they're not. Think AIPAC should probably register under Farah. They can go screw themselves with a wire brush for the same reason Act Blue can, because they gave so much money to Hakeem Jeffries and Elizabeth Warren. I don't care. They tend to lean left.

[1:42:56](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6176) But so should all the people who give money to universities, whether it's Qatar, whether it's China. We should know about the influence in our elections. We should know the proportionality, which is something people are avoiding. And I don't think that we should be having a consistent, guaranteed, relied-upon check to Israel. And I believe they have the right to exist. I think that's probably a position that most people would find sensible. There's no place for that. It's incredibly unsexy, isn't it? Because the Jews that are in control of the government is much more appealing. Yeah. As is, there's a genocide, which there isn't.

[1:43:26](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6206) You know, like, these two extreme positions, like on many other issues, are far more appealing, especially to dumb people, let's be honest. But I'm extremist. I'm an extreme right-wing. I'm just saying, like, that one is where I look at the truth and I go, okay... That's a very moderate position on this issue. It probably is a moderate position on this issue, but it's a position that, actually, it's not common ground. I'm not trying to find common ground based on a lie. you'll find probably some people on the left and on the right who would agree with that yep stop the guaranteed funding farrah got it we also need no other money in politics and wherever it makes sense for us to partner up great otherwise enjoy your I think that's a very sensible view and many Americans agree with it and we're funding all sides of the war in the Middle East we know that so like this is the problem that's not clippable that's a conversation that can take place and I say this as someone who has been accused of being reductive because I go well it's a life and you're aborting a life I go well a man can't become a woman this is one of those topics where the left believes in nuance for everything until there's an issue that actually requires nuance right they believe in nuance for everything

[1:44:30](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6270) But then, of course, they don't believe in it when there is no nuance. Like, well, there's nuance with gender. Okay, explain it to me. They can't answer it at all. But then with this issue, they just go genocide. You mentioned that. Like, I get it. By the way, your heart breaks for anyone. I don't want to end on this, but your heart breaks for someone. Someone has a black dog. The word genocide is for a cop. Why do you have a coal miner as your AD? I get him out. Like, I get it. And it's horrible. And your heart breaks when you see what's going on. Yes. but it's a pretty shitty genocide if you look at the percentage of population like i would imagine that that uh hitler would be very upset if there were six million more jews than when he started he'd probably have to have a follow guy like him like i forgot the carries a one something like that like that's he'd do a bit of ranting he'd be unhappy yeah he would be definitely like it's always some mundane details six million newtons not a mundane detail i would imagine that uh he would not be happy with that if he set out with the goal and by the way hitler's bad well done for most of the time yeah let's just be clear i mean i'm sure he did like some things

[1:45:37](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6337) that were like i'm sure every now and then he walked the dog and okay good for hitler walking so i don't want to make the simple reductive statement but as a general rule i'm not will i'm not afraid to take the the unpopular position i'm anti-hitler um i would imagine that if hitler set out with the stated goal of exterminating the Jews and there were more than when he started, he, so not me, I bet you he would tell you that it was a failure. Just an opinion. But we'll never know because God rest his soul, he left us too soon. He was inappropriate. What's one thing we're not talking about that we really should be?

[1:46:17](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6377) Before Stephen answers the final question, it's going to take about half an hour by the way at the end of the interview go to triggerpod.co.uk where you'll be able to see this if i have the guy with the biggest biceps smaller biceps you got 20 bigger biceps my biceps are 33 bigger than you congratulations i'm the guy with the bigger biceps can you describe some of the stealth effort efforts to discredit or compromise you honeypot financial gain bribes false leads give me the dirt what's the one thing we're not talking about that we really should be choose uh no uh what's the one thing that they get a lot of attention you know what it is um you know that caller daddy podcast yes i'm aware yeah they had uh kamala harris on there's a kamala i've just i've just you know it's fine because i go back and forth and then remembering the right i can't remember which one is it's uh that you know people talk about feminism quite a bit i do think most of our audience will be extremely unfamiliar with call her daddy podcast what is it well then that's a problem they have a blind spot because it's like the most popular female podcast out there that's what um um oh yeah you want me to uh summarize

[1:47:22](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6442) what it is yeah uh dumb telling women to be slutty okay uh it's like yeah it's like if world market if their little like home sweet home was just like bang every guy you see so uh why are you against that anyway cara well come on now come on i see oh yeah you're christian conservative yes i am and And I'm happily married. Right. I'm just pretending to be a real girl. No, no, that's okay. You're trying to do the edgy thing. Exactly. Not everyone has to be Nick Fuentes, Constantine. It's okay to be yourself. It's going to be hard for me to be Nick Fuentes, I feel. Hey, Nick Fuentes lives in you.

[1:47:54](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6474) No, so women... That's fucking worrying. There's a gay Mexican inside me, all right? What's with you and the gay... Whatever, whatever. Okay. Back to Call Her Daddy. Feminism is a problem. Feminism is how Marxism has definitely gotten a hold in the Western world. And I don't just mean, okay, women wanting to be able to go and go to school, whatever. I'm talking about the breakdown of gender norms. The breakdown of male-female roles and how they function in society. This shocked Dave Rubin. He was on my show in like 2016, I think. He was like, well, you know, you're conservative, but you're more of a libertarian like me.

[1:48:27](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6507) for example, I know you'd support same-sex marriage. I said, no, I don't. It sounds like Kermit the Frog, though. A little bit. He said, no, I don't. He goes, what? I said, yeah, I don't. I'm against it. If you want to have civil unions, fine. I said, but I think that marriage is an institution that exists because we wanted to recognize a nuclear family as a central building block of the American way of life. And I don't think that men and women are fundamentally interchangeable. And if you declare that they are, there's nothing a mother brings to a child that two fathers can't, and vice versa, I think that you're not going to like the gender-bending slope that you slide down.

[1:49:03](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6543) So, no, I'm against it. And it also, by the way, the same reason I'm against it is entirely consistent with, I do believe when people say interracial marriage, this used to be their arguments, is I believe that a black mom can provide everything to a child that a white mom can. Most of. You know, maybe not like, you know, cholesterol-lowering food. Like, you know, things to be fried. But I don't believe that a black dad and a white dad are worlds apart. I believe that a mom and a dad are. Okay. So that's why I say feminism started that, breaking down of the gender norms. And you can't say, yeah, yeah, yeah, whoever gets married, that's all fine. Love is love. And then have a problem with people declaring themselves to be another gender. I think it's very difficult to stake your claim there. But as it goes back to feminism, I use that because it's the biggest example. I'm trying to think of other big shows.

[1:49:48](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6588) Young women have no good examples to look up to. We talk about men very often, and it's true. But true, men are lacking a lot of good examples. But here's the thing. Men can kind of cobble it together from different people because there's usually something good. Like, I've heard you talk about Andrew Tate. And I've never had him on the show. I don't know enough about the court case. I know that I would disagree with him on a whole lot. But he was a world champion kickboxer. and some of his advice is get your shit together, get in shape. Instead of bitching about what the world owes you, get your finances together, make yourself someone that would be desirable to a woman.

[1:50:25](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6625) I think that all of us would go, okay, that part, a young man wouldn't be worse off taking that advice. Same thing you look at Joe Rogan. I'm not into the DMT thing and stuff like that. Some of the things he says, I disagree with. But he also is a self-made person who came from a pretty rough upbringing, and he talks about opportunity, pulling herself up by her bootstraps. He talks about living a strenuous life. In other words, there are good things you could take from that. The Call Her Daddy podcast, and it's very typical of most of these, there is nothing good for women to pull from. It's sleep with as many men as you want, put off marriage and having a family, be a boss bitch, and if the guy doesn't want you, it's his problem and he has no right to ask your body count.

[1:51:11](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6671) And the only counter that you have to it is sort of the Femcon. I think Andrew Wilson was on your show. They talk about on the right where they claim to be traditional, but it's a gimmick. And ultimately, they still have these crazy, unrealistic expectations of men and don't hold women accountable. Women, young women, have no good examples available to them in mainstream media culture and many really bad examples being jammed down their throat. And that is something that people are going to have to reconcile at some point. We've had a few women on the show who are really good. Louise Perry, Mary Harrington, Frendi, but these are people who are not huge names.

[1:51:51](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6711) And I also think part of it, even with those people, the reason that some of them are not huge names, I mean, there's many reasons that I can't speak for. I haven't seen them. I can guarantee you some of them aren't hot. Well, that is something I'm definitely not going to comment on. Some of them. You don't have to say which one. I guarantee you that at least one of them is not a bigger name because they're not hot. Actually, what I was going to say, you're wrong. What I was going to say... They're all hot. Got it. I'm going to go back and check those names. You do it. The reason that they're not actually big is quite often that what you are talking about, which is what you would describe as a healthy and productive way for a woman to be, necessarily means she's unlikely to be a content creator and influencer because they're doing what my wife is doing, which is being a mom and a wife. Right. Right. And I think that's partly a structure. You mean a tool of a patriarchy. That's right. Right. Tool or victim? No, victim of the patriarchy. Right. Well. Oh, no, she's worse. She's a tool. Yeah. You have her plowing the field. Do I? You should. Yeah. I don't. I need to get a field. Then I get a field.

[1:52:50](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6770) First, note to self, get field, then have woman plow it. Your point is better inspiration for young women and better messaging for young women. No, my point is they're not. Yeah. Yeah, and I say that, I mean, go look for them. Yeah. And a big part of it is that women choose to elevate these people. But here's the big thing is men will hold men accountable in a way that women don't tend to. Lindsay Clancy was a real, a lot of people said, were these bitches always as crazy? I go, yes. Not all of them, but more than you ever knew before. About half of Western women. Let's call it 30%. Yes. Yes. Many of them think that Lindsay Clancy is innocent and that she deserves sympathy and that you're a part of the patriarchy.

[1:53:33](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6813) Look, no jurors were willing to find that person guilty, except the black guy, which just screwed their whole plan. But the one thing that I love about that is remember we were all like, oh, this poor lone holdout juror who was henpecked, black guy, couldn't have cared less. Like, I don't give a fuck. He was probably making them give presentations. He's like, yeah, why don't you show me again why she's innocent? Bitch, get the fuck out of here. So yeah, it's men will, I mean, men in war, you have to hold men accountable, right? Men have to hold each other accountable. Hey, our friend died. What happened?

[1:54:02](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6842) Who got it wrong? Missed a pass. Hey, you didn't catch it. You don't get to say, yeah, but I didn't mean to. And yeah, but intent. And yeah, how I feel. Men constantly go through life in scenarios where we are held to account, whether it's proactively done by our friend or not, the situation does. Women can go a very long period of time, and most do, without encountering that. And so it's very easy to sell a lie and a fantasy. And I say call her daddy because this is someone who said, you know, you should go out and sleep with as many guys and get that bag. And then, by the way, also believes in retroactively removing consent.

[1:54:35](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6875) But she isn't living that way. She has a pretty wealthy husband or fiancé and is now having a child. So she's advocating, because this is what tells you is not how someone lives, it's what sells to women. what sells to women right now the market is really bad and there are no mainstream positive examples and so if we want to fix the gender gap here i mean i i run these things i'll say this i have something that i consistently reference in the show because i think everyone is saying how do we fix this right the loneliness epidemic loneliness epipen epidemic um men are checking out but they're checking out for the first time if you look at the the polling data men still want marriage and a family those are like their top top two things women it's like way down the list like number 10 11 there are two stats that matter because both sides say yeah it's actually you you have these crazy expectations and we're happy women go we're happier alone you have to compete with the fact that we have fulfilled lives and men are going no actually you have crazy expectations and we're fine with our hobbies one has to be right this comes to truth we have the end beyond any shadow of a doubt the data and i run these two graphs i believe they're both graphs on screen

[1:55:46](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=6946) all the time there was one study where they had many many women thousands i think hundreds of thousands i can't remember how many rate men on a scale from one to ten and then they had men rate scale, rate women on a scale from 1 to 10. Now this goes to Has more unrealistic standards. Men rated the women, and it looked like a perfect bell curve. The women rated the men, and it was a reverse hockey stick. Over 80% of the men were below statistical average, at which point average is a meaningless word. And then, so we have the answer. Who has more unrealistic expectations? Women. It's not even close. Then we look at, okay, the loneliness epidemic who's happier compared to men you can look at this chart women are consistently less happy and they're becoming less happy by the year while men are at the same rate or slightly happier so we promised young women that they could have it all and uh they did get everything except happiness and except fulfillment and we can't correct it by brow beating men or by telling men that you know what you need to listen more and you know we need to approach this from a feminine angle everything that we have done which has been uh tainted with feminism since the 1960s

[1:56:59](https://realalpha.app/v/Dtjhtm_TW2E/?t=7019) it's made women more delusional and it's made them significantly less happy so if you want men to stop checking out of the dating pool if we want to have a country if we want to have babies there needs to be a conversation with women and it needs to come from women because no vagina no opinion unless you're trans there we go steven thank you so much for coming on head on over to triggerpod.co.uk Okay, well, we're going to ask Stephen your questions. Oh, boy. Is there an area of modern life where you think the free market genuinely fails to produce a satisfactory outcome? And what would you do about it?